Comments on: Iran Hates Israel. Well, Duh. http://donklephant.com/2005/10/28/iran-hates-israel-well-duh/ Big Teeth. Huge Ass. Surprisingly Reasonable. Sat, 20 Mar 2010 23:56:52 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9 hourly 1 By: Amre http://donklephant.com/2005/10/28/iran-hates-israel-well-duh/comment-page-1/#comment-7944 Amre Mon, 13 Mar 2006 04:01:40 +0000 http://donklephant.com/?p=1211#comment-7944 Why do all these arab/muslim countries hate Israel. Maybe we should explore the underlying reasons before we go to war. The reason they hate Israel is the reason they hate the US (Israel's best friends). If the reason is religious, then we should realize that we are taking sides in a religious war, or crusade. If it is a religious war, then it is between Israel and its enemies. Why not address those issues, instead of blindly siding with Israel. Americans ask "why do they hate us?". Maybe this is why. Maybe this is why 9/11 happened. Maybe we should understand what we are getting into before we go. Why do all these arab/muslim countries hate Israel. Maybe we should explore the underlying reasons before we go to war. The reason they hate Israel is the reason they hate the US (Israel’s best friends). If the reason is religious, then we should realize that we are taking sides in a religious war, or crusade. If it is a religious war, then it is between Israel and its enemies. Why not address those issues, instead of blindly siding with Israel. Americans ask “why do they hate us?”. Maybe this is why. Maybe this is why 9/11 happened. Maybe we should understand what we are getting into before we go.

]]> By: Donklephant » Blog Archive » Wiped off the Map http://donklephant.com/2005/10/28/iran-hates-israel-well-duh/comment-page-1/#comment-3291 Donklephant » Blog Archive » Wiped off the Map Tue, 01 Nov 2005 00:17:17 +0000 http://donklephant.com/?p=1211#comment-3291 [...] I was wondering about the apparent surprise in European and U.N. high offices over the Iranian president’s recent casual statement that Israel ought to be wiped off the map — didn’t they realize Iran has been saying that for years. [...] [...] I was wondering about the apparent surprise in European and U.N. high offices over the Iranian president’s recent casual statement that Israel ought to be wiped off the map — didn’t they realize Iran has been saying that for years. [...]

]]> By: sleipner http://donklephant.com/2005/10/28/iran-hates-israel-well-duh/comment-page-1/#comment-3265 sleipner Mon, 31 Oct 2005 17:13:46 +0000 http://donklephant.com/?p=1211#comment-3265 The main question in my mind is, who will hit the big red button first? I'm almost certain that without extreme intervention (which may not even be possible) that either or both of Israel and Iran will probably be radioactive craters by 2020. I'm guessing that Iran will push it first, but probably Israel will still be able to respond with deadly force. Ahh, the world we live in. Anyone selling real estate on the moon yet? The main question in my mind is, who will hit the big red button first? I’m almost certain that without extreme intervention (which may not even be possible) that either or both of Israel and Iran will probably be radioactive craters by 2020. I’m guessing that Iran will push it first, but probably Israel will still be able to respond with deadly force.

Ahh, the world we live in. Anyone selling real estate on the moon yet?

]]> By: jimbo http://donklephant.com/2005/10/28/iran-hates-israel-well-duh/comment-page-1/#comment-3231 jimbo Sat, 29 Oct 2005 11:44:01 +0000 http://donklephant.com/?p=1211#comment-3231 Satori is on to something. Disarming Iran would be a huge military task and neither the US nor Israel are up to it. It is very important to understand that public opinion in the US is probably now not much different from public opinion in Europe. If 2,000 dead are too many to achieve the first democratic Arab state in world history while taking out a depraved dictator who warred on his neighbors and subsidized suicide bombers, then count the US out. American media and elites are going to take the European position that while Iran is a serious threat to Israel, it is no threat to us, and, besides, the Israelis are arrogant. Let us pray that the Iranian people can get their act together and overthrow the mullahs. Satori is on to something. Disarming Iran would be a huge military task and neither the US nor Israel are up to it. It is very important to understand that public opinion in the US is probably now not much different from public opinion in Europe. If 2,000 dead are too many to achieve the first democratic Arab state in world history while taking out a depraved dictator who warred on his neighbors and subsidized suicide bombers, then count the US out. American media and elites are going to take the European position that while Iran is a serious threat to Israel, it is no threat to us, and, besides, the Israelis are arrogant. Let us pray that the Iranian people can get their act together and overthrow the mullahs.

]]> By: Jeremy http://donklephant.com/2005/10/28/iran-hates-israel-well-duh/comment-page-1/#comment-3227 Jeremy Sat, 29 Oct 2005 04:28:15 +0000 http://donklephant.com/?p=1211#comment-3227 I think people are making a big deal about this because, according to Israeli statements to the UN Security council anyway, it's the first time in the history of the United Nations that the head of a state (as opposed to a civilian or other politican) has called for the complete destruction of another UN member. It's not so much the sentiment that's a shock, it's the source and the baldness of it. I think people are making a big deal about this because, according to Israeli statements to the UN Security council anyway, it’s the first time in the history of the United Nations that the head of a state (as opposed to a civilian or other politican) has called for the complete destruction of another UN member. It’s not so much the sentiment that’s a shock, it’s the source and the baldness of it.

]]> By: Satori http://donklephant.com/2005/10/28/iran-hates-israel-well-duh/comment-page-1/#comment-3226 Satori Sat, 29 Oct 2005 03:44:48 +0000 http://donklephant.com/?p=1211#comment-3226 Its easy to say we can stop iran from making nuclear weapons. Its EASY because were thousands of miles away and only the armed forces will have to deal with it right away. But take this into acount, Iraq attacked Iran when the Iraqi army was nearing its peak. Iran stopped them dead in there tracks to Suddams utter shock. NOW, iran has missles that can reach parts of europe and all of the middle east. Iraq and afganistan were easy, The taliban wasnt a organized government run army, and iraq was a skelaton of what it used to be. Right now iran is more powerful then iraq was at its peak, if we attack iran they could push atleast - ATLEAST 10 miles into iraq. We only have 120,000-150,000 troops in iraq at any given time. Iran could DOUBLE this number, systematicly taking out every carrier in the persian gulf, every american army base in the middle east and in Europe. Would they lose the war? Yes. We have such an advanced air force we could bomb them relentlessly for weeks and "liberate" the Iranians too. Isreal WILL attack iran befor we do. Does anybody remember the 6 day war? If the Isreali government thinks a Isreali Iran conflict is enevediable they will strike first and try to do as much damage as possible. If iran wants to attack isreal by ground it would have to either go across iraq (it could cut through american troops, outnumbering "patrols" with HUGE armored divisions. Or go through turkey and down through syria. We have the technological advantage but that can only get you so far. Going to war with iran would be devistating for america, the 2,000 we have lost in iraq could be a montly death toll. Iran DOES have ties to terrorist network (unlike iraq) and could step up supplies to fighters in afganistan and iraq (rocket propelled gernades). Kind of like what we did to the soviets when they were in afganistan. its foolish to think its our fault the middle east is fucked up, its been fucked up for thousands of years. However the mistake was not adding violence, it was involving ourself. After 9/11 we should have built up the CIA assasinated every al-queda member we could find and build the Trade towers two times the size they used to be. THAT would be saying YOU CANT STOP US. Its easy to say we can stop iran from making nuclear weapons. Its EASY because were thousands of miles away and only the armed forces will have to deal with it right away. But take this into acount, Iraq attacked Iran when the Iraqi army was nearing its peak. Iran stopped them dead in there tracks to Suddams utter shock. NOW, iran has missles that can reach parts of europe and all of the middle east. Iraq and afganistan were easy, The taliban wasnt a organized government run army, and iraq was a skelaton of what it used to be. Right now iran is more powerful then iraq was at its peak, if we attack iran they could push atleast – ATLEAST 10 miles into iraq. We only have 120,000-150,000 troops in iraq at any given time. Iran could DOUBLE this number, systematicly taking out every carrier in the persian gulf, every american army base in the middle east and in Europe. Would they lose the war? Yes. We have such an advanced air force we could bomb them relentlessly for weeks and “liberate” the Iranians too.

Isreal WILL attack iran befor we do. Does anybody remember the 6 day war? If the Isreali government thinks a Isreali Iran conflict is enevediable they will strike first and try to do as much damage as possible. If iran wants to attack isreal by ground it would have to either go across iraq (it could cut through american troops, outnumbering “patrols” with HUGE armored divisions. Or go through turkey and down through syria. We have the technological advantage but that can only get you so far. Going to war with iran would be devistating for america, the 2,000 we have lost in iraq could be a montly death toll. Iran DOES have ties to terrorist network (unlike iraq) and could step up supplies to fighters in afganistan and iraq (rocket propelled gernades). Kind of like what we did to the soviets when they were in afganistan.

its foolish to think its our fault the middle east is fucked up, its been fucked up for thousands of years. However the mistake was not adding violence, it was involving ourself. After 9/11 we should have built up the CIA assasinated every al-queda member we could find and build the Trade towers two times the size they used to be. THAT would be saying YOU CANT STOP US.

]]> By: Callimachus http://donklephant.com/2005/10/28/iran-hates-israel-well-duh/comment-page-1/#comment-3225 Callimachus Sat, 29 Oct 2005 02:09:54 +0000 http://donklephant.com/?p=1211#comment-3225 Probably too much is made of the centrality of martyrdom in the Shi'ite system of faith. But probably, too, there's a grain of truth to it, and its influence on the political culture of Shi'ite lands. In thinking about the current Iranian president, I recalled a passage from Ken Pollack's book on the U.S. and Iran, "The Persian Puzzle," at the end of his chapter on the 1953 coup: <blockquote> A last important legacy of Mohammed Mosaddeq was his martyr complex. Martyrdom and the story of Hussayn dominate Shi'i theology, and this is one reason why Mosaddeq himself doubtless found it easy to assume that role. Throughout his brief time in power, Mosaddeq pushed his convictions to an absurd extreme that courted disaster in what seemed to be a purposeful manner. Mosaddeq's example encouraged the belief among Iranians that staking out an extreme position, even if it would inevitably result in great hardships for oneself or for Iran as a whole, was the right course of action. The fact that Mosaddeq was even more popular after his overthrow than when he was prime minister has only reinforced that notion. This tendency would be resurrected to an even greater extent during Ayatollah Khomeini's reign, when Iran almost seemed to be actively seeking its own destruction by taking on the whole world and hewing to causes that had long been lost. </blockquote> Probably too much is made of the centrality of martyrdom in the Shi’ite system of faith. But probably, too, there’s a grain of truth to it, and its influence on the political culture of Shi’ite lands. In thinking about the current Iranian president, I recalled a passage from Ken Pollack’s book on the U.S. and Iran, “The Persian Puzzle,” at the end of his chapter on the 1953 coup:

A last important legacy of Mohammed Mosaddeq was his martyr complex. Martyrdom and the story of Hussayn dominate Shi’i theology, and this is one reason why Mosaddeq himself doubtless found it easy to assume that role. Throughout his brief time in power, Mosaddeq pushed his convictions to an absurd extreme that courted disaster in what seemed to be a purposeful manner. Mosaddeq’s example encouraged the belief among Iranians that staking out an extreme position, even if it would inevitably result in great hardships for oneself or for Iran as a whole, was the right course of action. The fact that Mosaddeq was even more popular after his overthrow than when he was prime minister has only reinforced that notion. This tendency would be resurrected to an even greater extent during Ayatollah Khomeini’s reign, when Iran almost seemed to be actively seeking its own destruction by taking on the whole world and hewing to causes that had long been lost.

]]> By: A Christian Prophet http://donklephant.com/2005/10/28/iran-hates-israel-well-duh/comment-page-1/#comment-3224 A Christian Prophet Sat, 29 Oct 2005 01:09:55 +0000 http://donklephant.com/?p=1211#comment-3224 There appears to be a death wish involved. See The Christian Prophet blog: http://christianprophecy.blogspot.com/ There appears to be a death wish involved. See The Christian Prophet blog:

http://christianprophecy.blogspot.com/

]]> By: neo-neocon http://donklephant.com/2005/10/28/iran-hates-israel-well-duh/comment-page-1/#comment-3222 neo-neocon Sat, 29 Oct 2005 00:46:42 +0000 http://donklephant.com/?p=1211#comment-3222 Do the Europeans delude themselves into thinking the Iranians don't actually mean what they say and that it's all just a meaningless macho rhetorical display? Or do the Europeans assume that the Iranians actually do mean what they say and the Europeans just don't care all that much--except, of course, for mounting their own meaningless rhetorical displays? Either way, it's dangerous. Do the Europeans delude themselves into thinking the Iranians don’t actually mean what they say and that it’s all just a meaningless macho rhetorical display? Or do the Europeans assume that the Iranians actually do mean what they say and the Europeans just don’t care all that much–except, of course, for mounting their own meaningless rhetorical displays?

Either way, it’s dangerous.

]]> By: AubreyJ http://donklephant.com/2005/10/28/iran-hates-israel-well-duh/comment-page-1/#comment-3221 AubreyJ Sat, 29 Oct 2005 00:08:38 +0000 http://donklephant.com/?p=1211#comment-3221 Israel’s Preemptive Strike on Iran AubreyJ’s short and not so sweet version… I would think that this is pretty much how all of this will go down… Let’s go straight to the Trigger Point… The endgame is going to be when Israel sees the moment of no return. When it sees its very survival at risk. At that moment when all talks between the Western World and Iran have completely failed, (like it’s doing now) and Iran has finally come up with everything necessary to make a deliverable nuclear weapon... at this point and probably not to far off in the future, Israel will feel compelled to strike. And so they will… And when the dust all clears… It will take this country to clean up the political mess left over from this inevitable upcoming strike… Bottom line is Iran will never- ever be allowed to have Nuclear Weapons… And the clock is winding down fast… AubreyJ……… Israel’s Preemptive Strike on Iran

AubreyJ’s short and not so sweet version…
I would think that this is pretty much how all of this will go down…
Let’s go straight to the Trigger Point… The endgame is going to be when Israel sees the moment of no return. When it sees its very survival at risk. At that moment when all talks between the Western World and Iran have completely failed, (like it’s doing now) and Iran has finally come up with everything necessary to make a deliverable nuclear weapon… at this point and probably not to far off in the future, Israel will feel compelled to strike. And so they will… And when the dust all clears… It will take this country to clean up the political mess left over from this inevitable upcoming strike… Bottom line is Iran will never- ever be allowed to have Nuclear Weapons… And the clock is winding down fast…
AubreyJ………

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