Comments on: Mixing Politics And Religion http://donklephant.com/2007/04/06/the-problems-with-mixing-politics-and-religion/ Big Teeth. Huge Ass. Surprisingly Reasonable. Mon, 01 Dec 2008 17:21:40 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.5 By: rabsteen http://donklephant.com/2007/04/06/the-problems-with-mixing-politics-and-religion/#comment-380878 rabsteen Sun, 19 Aug 2007 17:55:30 +0000 http://donklephant.com/2007/04/06/the-problems-with-mixing-politics-and-religion/#comment-380878 <i>eventually</i>? eventually?

]]> By: Godville http://donklephant.com/2007/04/06/the-problems-with-mixing-politics-and-religion/#comment-366340 Godville Wed, 04 Jul 2007 09:20:13 +0000 http://donklephant.com/2007/04/06/the-problems-with-mixing-politics-and-religion/#comment-366340 In applying the religious principles to our lives, the way we view politics and the system of leadership we choose will also be affected. There will be certain standards that we will want to maintain. When people who are not spiritually inclined, such as those who are atheistic, enter politics and become leaders by hook or crook, the whole atmosphere becomes increasingly covered with newscience and confusion. Such politicians may pose as having affiliations with some religion, but this is often done with a motive of getting in favor with people for the purpose of acquiring votes. Their real agenda is often hidden away and revealed much later. With such politicians in charge, beneficial programs meant for helping the poor or assisting with educational systems or the environment, often become reduced, cut back or are under-funded. Such funds that could be used for the benefit of the taxpayers are then diverted toward military development with the promise that it will make everyone more secure. Not knowing the duty of a good leader, such politicians engage in threatening and fighting with one another at the expense of the common people’s well being. Then in their distress, society may take spiritual life more seriously as they search for ways to find peace and solutions to their problems and help from God. with respect and love godville In applying the religious principles to our lives, the way we view politics and the system of leadership we choose will also be affected. There will be certain standards that we will want to maintain. When people who are not spiritually inclined, such as those who are atheistic, enter politics and become leaders by hook or crook, the whole atmosphere becomes increasingly covered with newscience and confusion. Such politicians may pose as having affiliations with some religion, but this is often done with a motive of getting in favor with people for the purpose of acquiring votes. Their real agenda is often hidden away and revealed much later. With such politicians in charge, beneficial programs meant for helping the poor or assisting with educational systems or the environment, often become reduced, cut back or are under-funded. Such funds that could be used for the benefit of the taxpayers are then diverted toward military development with the promise that it will make everyone more secure. Not knowing the duty of a good leader, such politicians engage in threatening and fighting with one another at the expense of the common people’s well being. Then in their distress, society may take spiritual life more seriously as they search for ways to find peace and solutions to their problems and help from God.

with respect and love
godville

]]> By: Alan Stewart Carl http://donklephant.com/2007/04/06/the-problems-with-mixing-politics-and-religion/#comment-301263 Alan Stewart Carl Sun, 08 Apr 2007 19:36:26 +0000 http://donklephant.com/2007/04/06/the-problems-with-mixing-politics-and-religion/#comment-301263 James Dobson and his ilk do not define American Christianity. To have an honest conversation about the role of Christianity in this country, we have to first understand the religion and not fall into the trap of stereotyping. For my church and many, many others, the issues of homosexuality and abortion just don't come up. In fact, it's extremely rare for any government policy to come up. We're far more concerned with issues of grace and love and redemption. Our focus is on bettering ourselves and our community -- not affecting government policy. Have certain politicos used certain Christians to advance political agendas. Yes. But that' far more a reflection on politics than it is on Christianity. Asking if Christians have lost their focus is the kind of question that completely misses the point. James Dobson and his ilk do not define American Christianity. To have an honest conversation about the role of Christianity in this country, we have to first understand the religion and not fall into the trap of stereotyping.

For my church and many, many others, the issues of homosexuality and abortion just don’t come up. In fact, it’s extremely rare for any government policy to come up. We’re far more concerned with issues of grace and love and redemption. Our focus is on bettering ourselves and our community — not affecting government policy.

Have certain politicos used certain Christians to advance political agendas. Yes. But that’ far more a reflection on politics than it is on Christianity. Asking if Christians have lost their focus is the kind of question that completely misses the point.

]]> By: Lewis http://donklephant.com/2007/04/06/the-problems-with-mixing-politics-and-religion/#comment-300855 Lewis Sun, 08 Apr 2007 03:01:12 +0000 http://donklephant.com/2007/04/06/the-problems-with-mixing-politics-and-religion/#comment-300855 Most all of the Christians I know would shake their heads and maybe smile a little at the thesis of this article. The only thing that matters to my Christian friends is their personal relationship to their savior. Everything else flows out of that. When it came to a point that being Christian meant caring only about abortion and homosexuality was when the media and other talking heads, out of their almost total ignorance of what a Christian is, starting printing this bunch of BS over and over again until it became urban legend. If you really want to know about Christians then spend time in church. You will find that for the most part, the urban legend is completely BS. Christians are good and caring people. Many believe that abortion is murder and should be stopped and won't support politicians that believe it's OK. Nothing wrong with that. And you will find many that think homosexuality is not natural. Hell, I thought that long before I ever became a Christian. Nothing wrong with that either - it's "naturally" repulsive to me as a man. That doesn't mean I hate them or wish them ill. But I'd be lying if I said the thought of two men corn-holeing each other didn't make me want to hurl chunks. Most all of the Christians I know would shake their heads and maybe smile a little at the thesis of this article. The only thing that matters to my Christian friends is their personal relationship to their savior. Everything else flows out of that.

When it came to a point that being Christian meant caring only about abortion and homosexuality was when the media and other talking heads, out of their almost total ignorance of what a Christian is, starting printing this bunch of BS over and over again until it became urban legend.

If you really want to know about Christians then spend time in church. You will find that for the most part, the urban legend is completely BS. Christians are good and caring people. Many believe that abortion is murder and should be stopped and won’t support politicians that believe it’s OK. Nothing wrong with that.

And you will find many that think homosexuality is not natural. Hell, I thought that long before I ever became a Christian. Nothing wrong with that either - it’s “naturally” repulsive to me as a man. That doesn’t mean I hate them or wish them ill. But I’d be lying if I said the thought of two men corn-holeing each other didn’t make me want to hurl chunks.

]]> By: Jimmy the Dhimmi http://donklephant.com/2007/04/06/the-problems-with-mixing-politics-and-religion/#comment-300674 Jimmy the Dhimmi Sat, 07 Apr 2007 20:07:58 +0000 http://donklephant.com/2007/04/06/the-problems-with-mixing-politics-and-religion/#comment-300674 <blockquote>Poverty? Whatever. Homelessness? An afterthought. </blockquote> What about charity? This guy seems to forget that you can help the poor with your own free will, rather than government-mediated socialist wealth distribution. He also doens't seem to realize that <a>Christians</a> are the most <a href='http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/1127/p01s01-usec.html' rel="nofollow">charitable</a> people in the country by far. <blockquote>A widening gap between the have and have-nots? Immaterial. </blockquote> It is immaterial if the poor are able to grow out of their poverty. You cannot simply determine who is poor based on lowest quintile of income; Christians measure poverty based on human suffering, not on the arbitrary distance between the wealthiest person. <blockquote>Divorce? The divorce rate of Christians mirrors the national average, so that’s no big deal.</blockquote> Does this guy advocate the government somehow getting involved in or regulating the rate of divorce? Hmm. <blockquote>The point is that being a Christian should be about more than abortion and homosexuality</blockquote>. A few points: 1) if it is indeed the case that these points seem to be the only major crossing point between religion and politics in America (which i happen to agree with) then it follows that there really is no threat of "Christianism" or theocracy, or a merger of church and state. Christians in this country tend to be fiscally conservative, which means they favor free-market principles regarding economic policy; therefore <em>less</em> mixing of their personal beliefs with government then secular socialists. 2) Pro-lifers believe that an unborn foetus has the same moral value as an infant child. I dont think that is such a crazy proposition to accept. Assuming it is true, Imagine if it was policy to allow or even use public funding for a massive euthanization of unwanted infants or toddlers across the county. The massive extinguishing of innocent human life would be a far more important issue than capitol-gains tax, requiring far more focus and attention. 3) If issues like homosexual marraige aren't really such a big deal relative to other issues, as the author seems to suggest, then maybe the non-religious people of this country are making too big a fuss over endorsing gay marraige. Maybe <em>they</em> should let it go and let people decide democratically. Maybe it is the secularists who are focussing to much on these issues and should compromise. Quid pro quo?

Poverty? Whatever. Homelessness? An afterthought.

What about charity? This guy seems to forget that you can help the poor with your own free will, rather than government-mediated socialist wealth distribution. He also doens’t seem to realize that Christians are the most charitable people in the country by far.

A widening gap between the have and have-nots? Immaterial.

It is immaterial if the poor are able to grow out of their poverty. You cannot simply determine who is poor based on lowest quintile of income; Christians measure poverty based on human suffering, not on the arbitrary distance between the wealthiest person.

Divorce? The divorce rate of Christians mirrors the national average, so that’s no big deal.

Does this guy advocate the government somehow getting involved in or regulating the rate of divorce? Hmm.

The point is that being a Christian should be about more than abortion and homosexuality

.
A few points:
1) if it is indeed the case that these points seem to be the only major crossing point between religion and politics in America (which i happen to agree with) then it follows that there really is no threat of “Christianism” or theocracy, or a merger of church and state. Christians in this country tend to be fiscally conservative, which means they favor free-market principles regarding economic policy; therefore less mixing of their personal beliefs with government then secular socialists.

2) Pro-lifers believe that an unborn foetus has the same moral value as an infant child. I dont think that is such a crazy proposition to accept. Assuming it is true, Imagine if it was policy to allow or even use public funding for a massive euthanization of unwanted infants or toddlers across the county. The massive extinguishing of innocent human life would be a far more important issue than capitol-gains tax, requiring far more focus and attention.

3) If issues like homosexual marraige aren’t really such a big deal relative to other issues, as the author seems to suggest, then maybe the non-religious people of this country are making too big a fuss over endorsing gay marraige. Maybe they should let it go and let people decide democratically. Maybe it is the secularists who are focussing to much on these issues and should compromise. Quid pro quo?

]]> By: probligo http://donklephant.com/2007/04/06/the-problems-with-mixing-politics-and-religion/#comment-300104 probligo Sat, 07 Apr 2007 05:00:47 +0000 http://donklephant.com/2007/04/06/the-problems-with-mixing-politics-and-religion/#comment-300104 As one who lives in a far more secular nation than is the US, I believe that the greatest wrong that could befall the electorate in NZ would be the religionification of politics. There have been several attempts at launching political parties based upon religious beliefs, including the Destiny Church. The most recent Christian party represented in Parliament 6 years ago was by a gent who has since been convicted of pedophilia. Add to that the attempts by the Exclusive Bretheran to influence and "buy" the right wing in this country and Australia and one does have to be a little concerned... Even more scary for me is the thought that so many people believe only one religion should be represented in Parliament. Oh, and it ain't Islam.. As one who lives in a far more secular nation than is the US, I believe that the greatest wrong that could befall the electorate in NZ would be the religionification of politics.

There have been several attempts at launching political parties based upon religious beliefs, including the Destiny Church. The most recent Christian party represented in Parliament 6 years ago was by a gent who has since been convicted of pedophilia.

Add to that the attempts by the Exclusive Bretheran to influence and “buy” the right wing in this country and Australia and one does have to be a little concerned…

Even more scary for me is the thought that so many people believe only one religion should be represented in Parliament. Oh, and it ain’t Islam..

]]> By: Pete A http://donklephant.com/2007/04/06/the-problems-with-mixing-politics-and-religion/#comment-299780 Pete A Fri, 06 Apr 2007 21:49:45 +0000 http://donklephant.com/2007/04/06/the-problems-with-mixing-politics-and-religion/#comment-299780 I believe some Christians have lost focus, while others (like Jim Wallis, ref. God's Politics, the book and blog) have not. Bush has fed off the "Christian cause," though I think he has neither helped nor hurt it any more than the extremists among us have self-inflicted the wounds from which they now suffer. I believe some Christians have lost focus, while others (like Jim Wallis, ref. God’s Politics, the book and blog) have not. Bush has fed off the “Christian cause,” though I think he has neither helped nor hurt it any more than the extremists among us have self-inflicted the wounds from which they now suffer.

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