Ron Paul Finishes 5th In New Hampshire. Is The Revolution Over?
By Justin Gardner | Related entries in 2008 Election, 3rd Party, New Hampshire, Ron Paul
There’s no doubt that Ron Paul supporters have to be discouraged today. After all, New Hampshire was supposed to be his state. Sure, you’ll hear Paulites talking about how Nevada is actually going to be his state, and if that doesn’t pan out it’ll be California, but just because you have money to spend in contests doesn’t mean you have any chance of winning them. And so the amount of stories like this will start to be the only ones written about him…
For months now the growing thousands of Ron Paul supporters across the country have been saying virtually everywhere they could, including the comments section of this blog by the hundreds, that the media, the polls and the prognosticators were all wrong. There was a conspiracy.Those Paul supporters were actually correct. The media, the polls and the prognosticators were, indeed, all wrong — about Barack Obama handily beating Hillary Clinton in the New Hampshire primary. The media that the Paul camp loves to hate was actually dead-on right about Ron Paul. He was a long shot. He misfired again. And he got pretty much the same share of New Hampshire GOP votes as the progressive polls, that Paulunteers also despise as frauds and fixed, unrepresentative statistical snapshots, had indicated he had all along.
I doubt that newsletter story really hurt him much in New Hampshire. The fallout after? Well, he’ll start losing supporters after today because of the combination of his loss and that story, but that muckraking probably only lost him a few hundred people tops in the Granite State. Still not enough to think he could have climbed to 4th. And folks, when you finish with 8% of the vote in the state with the biggest concentration of independents, well, it’s time to rethink whether or not you should be in the race. New Hampshire is tailor made for a Libertarian message, and it just didn’t resonate last night.
So what next?
Paul has the money to keep pushing through till after Super Tuesday, but it’s unlikely his campaign is going to catch fire and convert a ton of GOP voters over to his POV. He has been, is and always will be a candidate with a 3rd party message. You can’t expect to change a party completely when the the voters of that party still, by and large, support their leaders and the ideas they’re pushing.
What’s more, and you all are going to hate me for this, but at this point Paul’s campaign has been less successful than Howard Dean’s. I know, I’m ready for the onslaught, but look at the facts. All he has done is raise a bunch of money. He hasn’t changed any of the other candidates’ positions. Howard Dean turned the entire Dem establishment against the war, and that was ultimately the legacy of that campaign. Well, that and Howard Dean became the Democratic National Committee Chairman. A pretty decent coup for a so called “crazy” man.
So you have to ask yourself, what will Paul’s mark on this campaign be? How is he really effecting the dialogue? The most I think he could hope for is GOP candidates start talking a lot more about reigning in spending, but they were talking about that long before Paul came on the scene. Sure, some of Paul’s more hardline Libertarian ideas might catch on eventually, but something tells me it won’t be during the campaign season.
Where does all of this leave us? Well, if Paul continues deluding himself and his supporters that they can actually win the GOP nomination, I think he’s doing a disservice to the message of freedom that has attracted so much money and attention. It’s time to start pushing him to go 3rd party folks, otherwise all of your hard work will stop dead in its tracks in a little less than a month. Because that’s what will happen. I doubt he’s going to get any more massive money bombs dropped in his lap after these two losses. So the money will dry up, and after that…POOF! But if you start pushing him to go 3rd party, if you demand that he keeps running, then that gives the campaign new life to start raising money and mounting a national campaign to push his message on a national level. Sure, it’s going to be much more of an uphill battle because of the newsletter story, but one big press conference where he explains it all and admits he’s ashamed he let this happen under his name will heal a lot of wounds.
So, what will you do? Because you do realize it’s up to you, right? You created the idea of Ron Paul and you can recreate that idea if you want. But it’s fast approaching midnight and when the clock roll overs to Feb 6th, you may just find yourself holding the pieces of a broken campaign with no possible way of putting it back together again.
This entry was posted on Wednesday, January 9th, 2008 and is filed under 2008 Election, 3rd Party, New Hampshire, Ron Paul. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.
January 9th, 2008 at 10:20 am
His impact is much greater than Dean’s. The Dem’s would have awoken to the fallacy of the war at some point.
I saw a room full of people chanting “ban the Fed” on national television.
Paul’s fundraising should forever put to bed (as far as an honest discussion) the concept of campaign finance reform. He proved one, people always can outspend special interests if they want to and two, money is not determinative of election outcomes.
He also proved to us liberty folks that there are more of us out there.
Let the revolution begin!
January 9th, 2008 at 10:25 am
New Hampshire was a bummer for us Ron Paul supporters, no doubt, but there’s still a positive way to spin the election results to date.
If you combine the Iowa and NH vote totals, it shows that Ron Paul is alone in 4th place, with 22% more votes than Rudy Giuliani and 58% more votes than Fred Thompson.
Ron Paul has recieved 29,648 total votes, compared with 24,151 votes for Giuliani and 18,712 votes for Thompson.
Here’s the tally
TOTAL
IOWA NH VOTES Percent
Romney 29,949 73,806 103,755 30.0%
McCain 15,559 86,802 102,361 29.6%
Huckabee 40,841 26,035 66,876 19.4%
Paul 11,817 17,831 29,648 8.6%
Giuliani 4,097 20,054 24,151 7.0%
Thompson 15,904 2,808 18,712 5.4%
In a field of six strong candidates, Ron Paul is comfortably in 4th place, proving beyond a doubt that he is a top-tier candidate!
January 9th, 2008 at 10:31 am
Hasn’t changed any of the candidates positions? Really? Then why all of a sudden do we hear some of the other candidates talking more about the Constitution and IRS abolishment?
http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2008/01/06/politics/fromtheroad/entry3680193.shtml
January 9th, 2008 at 10:32 am
No, I am not discouraged today. I am not. WE, PAULITES, ARE NOT DISCOURAGED TODAY. On the contrary! Dr. Paul got a very high place yesterday. Consider the MSM efforts to silence him. Consider their efforts to disgrace his name by calling him a racist (I am a proud Latin supporter). Consider the many attacks he receives on daily basis.
On the other hand, did you ever notice the free publicity the others get from CNN, ABC, etc? Did you notice what FOX did to him? Did you notice any thing different in that respect? Chances are you pretend you did not notice any thing out of the ordinary. Dr. Paul’s ability to reach such a high place in the primary (given the circumstances) is amazing. He has such a wonderful chance to make it until the end. No matter what others what others want us to believe.
I left my country escaping comunism/fascism. I will fight with all my strenght and heart to protect the future of my very beloved new country, AMERICA. And I belong to the group of people that can tell a lie apart, can spot deceit, despotism and falsehood a mile away. Life is not worth living if basic liberties are taken away from us. Live free or die! VIVA RON PAUL!
P.S. If any Americans want to be told what to think and what to expect for their future, better move to a country 90 miles south.
January 9th, 2008 at 10:40 am
Personally I hope he sticks it out and continues to take in around 10% of the vote until Feb 5th. It’d be in line with my expectations and besides, somebody needs to talk speak about fiscal conservatism.
Afterward he should continue to communicate via whatever vehicle he deems best to harass the GOP on their fascination with the religious right’s social agenda to the exclusion of fiscally sound policies.
I’m still coming to grips with the fact that after the primaries are over, I’ll be voting for a democrat… there’s a first time for everything I suppose, but if the GOP wants my vote back then somebody better start making some real straight talk on how they’re going to get this country financially sound.
January 9th, 2008 at 10:41 am
Starting to agree. I think a 3rd party run could be pretty successful because he has already pulled a lot of support. I say he sticks it out as GOP for now so he can remain in the debates, but I think 3rd party is the way to go in the long run.
January 9th, 2008 at 10:43 am
Paul blew it in New Hampshire because he (and more so, his supporters) had no grasp of the issues in New Hampshire. He spent way too much time talking about immigration (a non-issue here, as shown by Romneys melt-down) and The Federal Reserve System (not on *anyones* radar screen as an issue). If he had stuck to the war, to spending, and aggressively addressed health care, he could have been a force to be reckoned with. Someone needs to get his mind off of the gold standard for the rest of the campaign…
January 9th, 2008 at 10:53 am
A third party run is the most likely end-game, but Paul needs to stay in the Republican race through at least super-Tuesday.
Since the field is crowded with candidates who are likely to oversee a complete disintegration of the party’s coalition base, anything could happen, and anyone could emerge as the eventual nominee. If Paul just maintains his current, steady results, we’ll pick up some electors and have some clout in a brokered situation. At the very least, it gives us a spot at the table when the GOP gets around to trying to put together a viable national coalition.
There is still a narrative that sees Paul compete for the nomination. Giulliani and Romney - the two favorites for the past year, are all but dead and buried. Huckabee and McCain both face major pockets of resistance in the broader party, and I can’t see either as the party’s eventual nominee. Even if he doesn’t win a majority, Paul could pick up a sizeable portion of votes by default - there are a lot of GOP voters who won’t vote for McCain (immigration, campaign finance, fiscal policy, etc) or McCain (immigration, taxes, wearing the Jesus mantle) under any circumstances, and might move toward Paul as the least objectionable candidate.
I am in favor of making a third party run - a four way race with Paul and Bloomberg in as independents versus McCain & Clinton is a very interesting prospect - but at the right time. In my opinion, it is not time to bail on the primary process until it has played out.
If the process has proved anything so far, it is that things change very quickly. Paul supporters must remain confident and active, because we’re in better shape today than John McCain was a month ago, and we all see how his fortunes have changed. And we’ve still got a campaign warchest that is the envy of the GOP field.
It’s not over yet, and those who wish to play the funeral dirge will have to hold off for a while.
As for me, I can’t wait for my own opportunity to vote in the primary for Paul, and then - one way or the other - in the general election.
The movement is what is most important, and I don’t believe anything coming out of Iowa or NH has done a thing to damage our hopes. We didn’t do a shock and awe number on the ballot box, but we’re still hanging around. As long as we’re in the hunt, we keep the movement alive and get to keep educating the average voter. We may not win this election when all is said and done, but all is not said and done. There is a lot of crazy stuff that can happen between here and there, and the economy is tanking fast. While I don’t wish for that to accelerate, it will only draw more people to Paul’s message.
January 9th, 2008 at 10:55 am
It does matter I’ll still vote for RON Paul no matter what! I stand true to
my belief’s and so does RON PAUL!! It really doesn’t matter, Iowa, NEW Hempshire doesn’t repesent the whole country. Look just becuase MAC won New Hempshire does mean much. MAC has no change out here in the West coast with supporting Amnesty. RON PAUL will continue to fight for our rights and Liberty and that alone shows that he has done more for you then any other candidate will and can do for you.
January 9th, 2008 at 10:56 am
oops…. the Jesus mantle was about Huckabee….. not McCain
January 9th, 2008 at 10:59 am
Rob, have you checked out Fred Thompson? He talks straighter than any candidate out there, even Paul. Check out his website if you haven’t.
January 9th, 2008 at 11:04 am
You forgot a very important word here, which I’m inserting in CAPS:
“…but one big press conference where he explains it all and admits he’s ashamed he UNINTENTIONALLY let this happen under his name will heal a lot of wounds.”
…cos that’s how it was - he did NOT know, and as soon as he became aware, he took immediate action.
As for third party, what’s your agenda exactly, Mr Gardner? Why not ask Julie Annie or Fred Flintstone at this stage? I mean, if we’re gonna take your advice, we should know what your intentions are, no?
January 9th, 2008 at 11:04 am
Van honestly, why would I trade a long-shot for a no-shot? Thompson’s gonna bow out after Florida.
January 9th, 2008 at 11:10 am
Well said Micah. Better than the original story:) The polls are all over the place for the other candidates. Ron Paul is slow and steady. I am still in shock over old, angry man McCain’s win who wants to stay in Iraq for 100 years. Romnie still has a huge question mark. Julie Annie isn’t doing any better and he is, supposedly, “America’s Governor.” Thompson is due or die in S. Carolina. I too, see myself either writing in Ron Paul next fall or voting Dem. The rest of the facists will only pull back the throttle and push the nose over to the inevitable crash and burn.
January 9th, 2008 at 11:16 am
Right now the most likely republican candidates appears to be Romney (retch), Huckabee (see Romney), McCain (passable), and maybe Giuliani (…)
For the dem’s it’s Clinton (moderate but a divisive spendaholic) and Obama (bleeding-heart with a decent foreign policy).
A fiscally sound domestic policy trumps all, but barring that foreign policy is the deciding factor for me. Seeing as how those six names are all big spenders (I seriously hate the neocon leadership) I’m left with foreign policy.
The republican’s offer three hawks and huckleberry, the dems have it better (imho), but Hillary will inevitably end in gridlock. Normally in the absence of sound domestic policies, gridlock is preferable, but foreign policy is our greatest morale and money sink at the moment and we can’t afford more of the same.
That leaves me with the empty suit, because in this weird world he’s somehow viable.
January 9th, 2008 at 11:19 am
My take: New Hampshire was the high water mark for Paul, for all the reasons Justin mentions. 8% represents the Libertarian swing vote in the US. Not enough to be a 3rd party that can elect candidates but enough to be a spoiler as a 3rd party. Since we have a highly polarlized, roughly balanced partisan electorate, It is also big enough to determine the direction of American politics, if it can be organized to swing as a group between R’s and D’s.
This number is consistent with what David Boaz and Cato determined to be the (small l) libertarian swing vote. The question is how can these “cats be herded”? If either major party was interested enough in attracting these voters, they could pander to them like any other interest group and potentially win the election as a result. Of course that means they would have to embrace some libertarian policies. Absent that, and absent a candidate to rally around, the organizing principle would have to be something extremely simple, clear, easy to communicate, easily rationalized and proven to keep the country moving in a libertarian (more freedom, more peace, less intervention, smaller government) direction. I have outlined here before, the only organizing principle that meets that criteria - Voting for Divided Government. Every time.
January 9th, 2008 at 11:20 am
Voters are stupid. What more needs to be said? People whine and bitch about elected officials, about how corrupt they are, but in the end they’ll still vote for them. You have a candidate in Ron Paul who is completely from the people, and he gets rejected, in NH of all places.
I wouldn’t say the Revolution is over, but it’s certainly down. This is Paul’s Valley Forge moment. It’s still early, and Paul has the cash to compete through Super Tuesday. But it does look dim.
I’ll say this though. The Republican Party is about to lose the general election in Reagan/Mondale proportions.
January 9th, 2008 at 11:26 am
I don’t see how you think Obama has a passable foreign policy, but thats my own opinion. I think he is weak.
I also think it is absurd to count Mitt out after two second place finishes, and a first place finish in WY, especially considering both IA and NH had far different first place finishers.
I know it’s a long shot but I am still hoping Thompson can pull it out. It’s to bad he doesn’t get more attention, but it’s understandable considering he is obviously not a “30 second soundbite” guy.
I’m in FL, and assuming assuming Thompson continues to preform abysmally, I will be voting Guilliani on the 29th.
January 9th, 2008 at 11:32 am
Two words: Name Recognition. I still have tons of people ask me who he is and then I ask them if they know who Guilliani or McCain is and 95% do. Having said that he is coming up fast. He was only a few thousand votes behind Rudy Guilliani who everyone knows. Rudy campaigned and spent money in the state. Paul has gone from 1-2% in the polls 2 months ago to 8-10%. Here’s the math… He has and will continue to get money, the others don’t. Hunter and Thompson will drop out soon, followed by McCain after South Carolina. Rudy will not win Florida. The field will narrow and as that happens more people will hear his message, recognize his name and he will pick up more and more votes. The fat lady has not sung. :)
January 9th, 2008 at 12:01 pm
10% in Iowa was a strong showing in a state not very receptive to his message. 8% in New Hampshire is disappointing, but not surprising — voter turnout there is much higher, so it’s harder for a more enthusiastic and better organized support base to get any kind of multiplier effect over the poll numbers.
I’m not buying into the vote fraud conspiracy, but Hillary’s surprise victory over Obama makes me at least consider the possibility a little more seriously.
I’m not giving up, not by a long shot. Michigan allows Democrats and independents to vote, and the Democratic Party results don’t even count. A good showing there could propel Ron Paul to an even stronger showing in Nevada, where he has been outworking the other candidates.
Ron Paul is right. The Revolution goes on, and the time to take stock of what to do next is February 6th. For now, it’s time to keep on fighting.
Giuliani hasn’t given up, and he’s received fewer votes so far than Ron Paul, has probably less cash on hand, and doesn’t have 1/100 of the volunteer base.
January 9th, 2008 at 12:06 pm
I won’t go so far as to call Paul’s performance a victory, but I wouldn’t characterize it as a loss either. The final vote tallies, even with absentee ballots will still place Paul 5th in the primary, but let’s analyze the numbers a bit. The number of votes between 3rd place Huckabee and 5th place Paul is a “whopping” (sarcasm intended) 8170. Considering that nearly 227,000 votes were cast for republican candidates, an 8000 vote difference is not as catastrophic as your article attempts to portray. You’ve counted Paul out of the race after what?… Three states which represent, maybe 1.5% of the total U.S. population?
The fact that Giuliani, a household name and the media’s golden child up until about 6 weeks ago could only garner 2000 more votes than Paul says a great deal about the Paul campaign (and quite frankly the Giuliani campaign as well)… they are very successful despite the glaringly obvious lack of media coverage. McCain has essentially been campaigning in New Hampshire since 1999 and Romney spent 10’s of millions of dollars there (though not as much as Giuliani… an interesting little factoid for you) AND it’s his neighboring state. No one in the Paul camp expected to take 1st or 2nd in New Hampshire. We looked optimistically to a 3rd or 4th place finish and I personally feel that we are all pretty darn satisfied coming in what is essentially a tie for 4th.
This is only the 3rd state in the race… there is a long haul ahead and Paul has the funds to keep his presence strongly in the race. History has already proven… to McCain personally back in 2000… that winning the NH primary doesn’t really mean all that much in determining who the eventual nominee will be. Iowa was far from fertile ground for Paul, Wyoming was, well… Wyoming… and New Hampshire is just a temporary win for McCain in a heat race. It’s the finals that count and they are occurring on February 5th.
I don’t count Paul out… no not in the least. He’s showing up very well despite being virtually ignored in the national press. America is still very much a sound byte nation filled with people who get all of their facts from NBC, CBS, and ABC. A grassroots movement takes time to grow and I think we’re showing signs of some very solid roots. The resulting grass could end up being a lot greener than short-sighted folks like you could have ever imagined.
As for your analysis that NH is “independent” land… that’s not entirely accurate. The media likes to call the state the land of independents, but it’s more correctly characterized as the land of “undecided’s” and there is a BIG difference between the two. What should be terrifying to the GOP is that McCain’s first place numbers with 80,000+ votes put him in a distant third place when compared to Hillary’s and Obama’s numbers. The “undecided’s” in New Hampshire spoke loudly and clearly that they are buying the media hype surrounding the democrats… they’ve drunken the Hillary Kool-Aid and they are enamored with Obama’s oratory prowess.
The GOP is toast in the General Election and only Paul has a legitimate shot at positioning the GOP as a different (and better) choice over the democrats.
Time to wake up America… the race is just getting started!!
January 9th, 2008 at 12:13 pm
Nothing’s broken. Like you said, it’s the “idea of Ron Paul”, not Ron Paul. The idea cannot be broken.
January 9th, 2008 at 12:18 pm
Ron Paul needs to keep fighting and putting out the message. The country still believes in him. His supporters need to pull up the boot straps because its going to be a race. Do NOT give up. The fight is still very much alive. Talk to people and educate them. All they need to do is listen to him speak and the man convinces people. We all have seen it.
From a strategic stand point, I think its time that Ron Paul gets a little more aggressive. He needs to use his knowledge of this country’s history and tie it into current day. Go after these guys one at a time. Its obvious that the big battles are what gets media attention. If he keeps sitting in the background he won’t get noticed. Take them to task on their voting and policies and compare them to his own. Do what he does best and that is debate anyone anytime anywhere.
Thats right Dr. Paul, go on offense. It’s time for the wow factor. Tell those other fakes that they need to stop using The Constitution in their debates simply because its convenient. They want your momentum! School them!
Tell the people: “This is YOUR Country and its time to take it back!”
January 9th, 2008 at 12:18 pm
Ron Paul is just beginning to receive funding sufficient to get noticed. Most candidates have already spent what he just raised.
And speaking of problems, wait till the sexist, bigoted, racist nature of Romney’s Mormon heritage and current belief system get a good airing… which they will if he gets the Repub nomination.
Ron Paul separates his religious beliefs from his politics. I’ll continue to support him. If for no other reason that his message continues to be heard.
January 9th, 2008 at 12:19 pm
I think the explanation lies not with Ron Paul’s message or with people dredgfing up recycled stories of racism (again). It does not lie with fund raising. I think the biggest part of the problem lies with us the voters. The majority of voters are uninformed and not free thinkers. I was dismayed by the huge percentage of people I saw interviewed both in Iowa and New Hampshire right up until the day they voted who were undecided. I can only explain it by them being unprepared or not able to make decisions, either way, people like that are never going to be attracted to Ron Paul as their candidate. It takes a little work, a little thought, and an ability to think for yourself to come to the conclusuion that we need Ron Paul. I am not trying to say that someone who does those things necessarilly will agree with and support Ron Paul, they may not, but those who put in no effort will never just happen to support him…the same cannot be said for Romney, McCain, Giulinani, Huckabee, Thompson, Hillary, Obama or Edwards just based on media exposure/fame. One of the aspects I like about Ron Paul is that he is not a politician in the usual sense, but it that same attribute which will limit his media exposure and popularity.
I will be voting for him in the primary. I will vote for him in the general election by whatever means, even if I have to write him in. There will be no reason to vote for the Democratic candidate because as long as they are running against a pro-war Republican they will win without my vote.
January 9th, 2008 at 12:32 pm
I’d like to see Paul use the money we sent to keep pushing the message: fiscal responsibility and wisdom, liberty for all peoples, national sovereignty, Constitutionalism, transparency in government, peace, and prosperity.
The new newsletter article was a bombshell for me. Even considering the statement that Paul neither authored the articles nor seemed aware of them [for how long?] . . . he needs to come out with a better explanation, condemnation, and disassociation.
Assuming he does that then I really want to see him in the debates conceivably until the negotiated candidate selection in Fall - as a Republican candidate. A consistent 10% should be enough to do this - especially as Hunter and perhaps somebody like Thompson are likely to drop out. Third party candidates are far too easily ignored. Huckabee, Romney, heck even McCain have all started picking up parts of Paul’s message. He’s had a definite impact on much of the rhetoric. I’d like to see him keep it up.
January 9th, 2008 at 12:36 pm
“Howard Dean turned the entire Dem establishment against the war, and that was ultimately the legacy of that campaign. Well, that and Howard Dean became the Democratic National Committee Chairman.”
He did? Perhaps you can explain why your top-tier candidate not only supports the war, but also has designs for Iran?
If liberals ACTUALLY believe their party and their candidates are anti-war, they will get exactly what they deserve for being so glaringly stupid.
And McCain got the anti-war vote in NH?
Like I said, we get the government we deserve. People are apparently THAT fucking stupid.
January 9th, 2008 at 12:37 pm
Paul is being hurt by Obama and Hillary in states like NH. Since the independents can choose which primary to vote in, young voters and libertarians are choosing to go with the Democratic side (see the sheer volume of voters compared to the Reps). I think if there wasn’t an Obama in the race, Paul would see much better results. Perhaps closed primaries will actually be better for him.
January 9th, 2008 at 12:53 pm
He needs to stay in, it is in the Americans peoples interest he stays and I will support him. Furthermore this Revolution is here to stay and it will percolate to local elections. We have a Godless movement that is dangerous, the Neocons. Like Communism before the Neocons, Financed by the same bankers, are spreading their ideals and “freedom, and free markets” on the tip of a bayonet. The Neocons are doomed to fail once Americans wake up and assert our National Values. The Constitution will NOT be subverted without protest!
January 9th, 2008 at 12:54 pm
I have never been more disappointed in my life. This is a sad day for America. How in the world can more people vote for flip-flopping, pandering, war-mongering liars…Than vote for Dr. Paul? Actually, I know the answer. I live with the answer…..My wife would rather read about Brittany Spears’ trouble, than read about our economy, our lose of liberty, or the war in Iraq. I am sure I am not alone….
January 9th, 2008 at 1:02 pm
Actually, we already have multiple examples of vote fraud in NH. One example is the town of sutton. votes were listed as 0. Bev Harris of Black box voting called the clerk, who admited Paul had 31 but they were not tallied. That is only one example.
I am certain Obama was cheated as well. 80 % of the machines in NH are the diebold machines that were banned from some other states and were responsible for the 2004 election fraud.
“It’s not who votes that counts. It’s who counts the votes”
Joseph Stalin.
January 9th, 2008 at 1:04 pm
This is why I’m not discouraged about Dr. Paul’s prospects. While many of us political junkies have been living and breathing this campaign for months, we are not typical Americans in that respect. Politics is not their thing, or their life. They have other priorities but they come forward and do their civic duty on election day. It is these people who are only, just now, starting to pay attention to the presidential campaign. Political junkies and the pundits wonder how this can be so, but I assure you that it is so. We have seen the difference that a week makes. Imagine what can happen between now and Feb. 5. And guess what. Dr. Paul has money to get his powerful message out in many states and continues to raise between $50,000 and $100,000 every day. People will wonder about this guy, who polls as well as Rudy in Iowa and New Hampshire. They’re getting a eyeful of that blimp in South Carolina. And then there’s “THE MESSAGE.” I wish I had a dollar to give to Ron Paul for every time my late father told me that he was a social moderate and a fiscal conservative. So many people will love Dr. Paul’s message, if they have a chance to hear it.
After Feb. 5th, we’ll see. We’ll know then if Dr. Paul will have enough delegates to be a force at the convention. A third party is a hard route. What we need to do is to take over the GOP, or at least form the basis for an eventual takeover of the GOP, by its historic, libertarian base. It is short-sighted to look at the Paul Revolution as something that ends in November.
January 9th, 2008 at 1:08 pm
For the record I didn’t count Romney out, in fact he’s the most likely nominee at the moment imo, but I sure as hell am not going to vote for that phoney.
As a long time republican I honestly feel like I’m watching a train wreck in slow motion and as el rushbo mindlessly toots the whistle.
January 9th, 2008 at 1:30 pm
Ron Paul will lose, the constitution will lose, we the people will lose and it’s sad. From the beginning of time man has struggled against tyranny and greed and it seams we always lose. Why? It’s meant to happen, it’s our destiny. This country will fall as all countries do but we that understand must remember, “no one can destroy our beliefs, our dreams, our faith”. Prepare yourselves and cradle those you love soon comes the time for all to suffer. Never forget, there is no end only transformation to a time and place that knows no end. HAVE FAITH, BELIEVE….
January 9th, 2008 at 1:34 pm
“It’s not those who vote who decide, it’s those who counts the votes.” - Joseph Stalin
Want proof:
http://thewalk.com/wp/2008/01/09/ron-paul-votes-not-counted-in-new-hampshire-district/
http://www.ronpaulwarroom.com/?p=721
http://www.opednews.com/articles/genera_melinda__080109_99_ways_to_steal_ele.htm
http://generationtwixter.blogspot.com/2008/01/new-hampshire-primaries-voter-fraud.html
Give it up for electronic voting machines, where your votes don’t count anymore.
Who’s side are you on, Justin, the people our the corrupted establishment.
If you don’t report on the vote frauds, then I’ll have my answer.
January 9th, 2008 at 1:57 pm
I don’t think the story was expected to hurt him that much. It was just intended to ensure Giuliani did not loose to him a second time (Kirchick is a Giuliani supporter). That’s exactly what happened. Giuliani beat Paul by the smallest of margins.
January 9th, 2008 at 2:03 pm
Two more links that prooves the NH Primary was a fraud:
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/january2008/010908_district_admits.htm
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/january2008/090108Fraud.htm
January 9th, 2008 at 2:23 pm
Well, Rob thanks tor that candid reply, it’s what’s needed in this country - a bit of humility! To reward your honesty, here’s a good one for ya:
My wife, a democrat as long as I’ve known her, saw RP on Meet the Press and immediately said, “Sign me up, i love him, we’re registerin Repub. this time!” I told this story to my FAR RIGHT family @ the holiday gatherings and they got a nice chuckle out of it. Fiscal conservative? Constitutional purist? Anti welfare state and illegal immigration? Doesn’t matter - he’s a quack, a nutcase. All they see is that he takes some conservative votes away from this guy, and some indie votes away from that guy.
So they go the way they came: all for one and one for all - it must be that ‘with us or against us’ attitude that does them in. More n more- we’re against ya!!!
January 9th, 2008 at 2:43 pm
Ben, my guess is they’re drinkin rush’s koolaid. I used to look to him for a conservative counterpoint to NPR, but this election season he’s been a mindless Romney shill. Towing the party line does not equal intelligent discourse.
Someone needs to remind him that the philosophy for electing Presidents isn’t the same as the one used for picking horses… at least it shouldn’t be.
January 9th, 2008 at 2:52 pm
Look at Huckabee’s statements on printing money and spending. Sounds almost exactly like Ron Paul’s website.
January 9th, 2008 at 3:34 pm
Ron Paul is not important, his message is. And the other candidates needs to listen, whoever ends up with the republican ticket will greatly benefit from an Ron Paul endorsement. I hope Paul continues through Feb 5th, spends all the campain money and then endorse one of the other republican candidates.
January 9th, 2008 at 4:18 pm
Your Statement:
“Howard Dean turned the entire Dem establishment against the war”
I stopped reading after I read that part
your credibility < 0
This is Stage 3 of the Paul Campaign
January 9th, 2008 at 4:27 pm
Well, that makes me feel better. Apparently people are still VERY scared of Dr. Paul. I guess they are all aware by now of the vote fraud in Sutton, and they’re scared to DEATH of the recount that will show the GOP’s hand in supressing Dr. Paul.
January 9th, 2008 at 5:47 pm
It had been, still is, and will continue to be extremely challenging for Paul to win the Republican nomination. New Hampshire, though, was the “Live Free or Die” state in 1964, and that didn’t preclude the voters there from passing over Goldwater (and Rockefeller) to choose Lodge.
His message of states rights, civil liberties, and no war is seemingly out of place among either major party right now. Although the Republicans were the party of smaller government for a few decades, the Republican Party’s first major legislation and president resulted in a vast strengthening of the federal government, curtailment of civil liberties, and more government programs. Of course, with the election of Bush II, the platform was wholly abandoned.
The Democrats, the original party of Jefferson, that paragon of states rights issues, abandoned their limited-government roots by 1912 at the latest with the election of Wilson. From then to the New Deal, Great Society and beyond, the party has stood for more government programs, widening the scope of federal involvement, and subsidies for one group over another. They’ve continued to champion civil rights issues even as their presidents have dutifully signed bills into law which resulted in larger and larger minorities being sent to prison for non-violent offenses.
So, Paul’s message of small government seems to fit with the message of the Republican Party nearly twenty years ago, a platform it held for only a small portion of its existence. It represents the original ideas of Jefferson and others, but the party of Jefferson abandoned those ideas nearly a century ago. Thus, Paul’s message no longer fits into either party’s platform.
Does his message fit with the platform of the Party for Large Government or the Party for Larger Government? And which is which any more?
Maybe Paul’s strategy from here on out should be pointing out the abject philosophical failures that his competition represents. Not the fact that Paul is principled, supported by veterans, a veteran himself, or catching on. Nearly all the other candidates say the same things about themselves. But it’s time to take the gloves off and go after his morally and philosophically bankruptcy of the rest of the field.
Any candidate can portray himself as a nice guy. Paul is a nice guy; his commercials show how much of a nice guy he is. But the competition also puts out commercials saying their nice guys. Maybe some of that November 5/Tea Party campaign cash should be used to show voters that they’re really not nice guys; in fact, they’re corrupt, pandering, war-mongering liars supporting a president whose policies are destroying the Republican Party, the economy, and the image of America around the world.
Go after them once in a while, Dr. Paul. Use the money you’ve been sent to debate your opponents through more combative commercials when they can’t laugh over you or start shouting you down. That’s a tactic that’s been used against you; turnabout is fair play.
He should think about going after Romney’s flip-flopping, McCain’s war-mongering imperialism, Giuliani’s war on civil liberties, and Huckabee’s criminal-releasing tax-increasing record.
The combative anti-Fed stump speech doesn’t have to be put on hold. But Paul should bring that combativeness to the race he’s trying to win.
January 9th, 2008 at 7:44 pm
Ronny - We hardly knew ye….
Friends, Americans, Libertarians, lend me your eyes. I come to bury Ron Paul, not to praise him. The good politicians do live after them, the not-so-good should be interred with their bones…. Justin Gardner at Donklephant asks “Is the Revolution Ove…
January 9th, 2008 at 10:01 pm
Look at the issues that we face, if you don’t believe me check into it for yourself Please!! If you truly care about our children and future, and in their childrens. His information David Walker He is Comptroller General of the United States, look what he has to say about how much debt American is really in why the government is covering it up. He’s totally bipartisan as a 15 year term and why the presidential candidates are not speaking about it. Except for one Ron Paul, and he should bring this up more while he’s campaigning. Http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/03/01/60minutes/main2528226.shtml
January 9th, 2008 at 11:08 pm
What would YOU do, astute journalist Justin Gardner? When your country fails to recognize that Ron Paul is right and is trying to save this country from itself.
Some of us remember that the founding fathers drafted the constitution to restrain the power of federal government, else it will fall suddenly like the great roman empire.
I am not accepting the lesser of two evils. I am for the once in a lifetime leader Ron Paul. To the end. You can compromise, for popularity, on donklephant, or whatever. But its serious to me, and I’m sticking with my man who has never compromised, even when the others laugh at him.
Our troops aren’t laughing when they donate more to him than anybody else.
God, we really do need a revolution.
I wish everyone who parrots “we need to win in Iraq first” (including hannity) would define ‘win.’ I used to identify with the warhawks until I realized that our troops are not being used to defend our country. They are being used as tools, and its a GD shame.
January 10th, 2008 at 1:41 am
Yes, we Ron Paul supporters are a little let down, but we have been busy since the Primary with the more important matter of sorting out the errors in the New Hampshire voting result.
I am happy to announce the Greenville and Sutton precints in New Hampshire have admitted they omitted Dr. Paul’s votes on the count, having giving him zero votes. Guess they forgot to count them. Today they were forced to correct those errors by adding 30 and 21 votes respectively. Still checking other figures. This is just two
examples of potential vote fraud and it was an amateurish attempt to deprive him of votes. It is possible the other candidates were hurt/helped by this as well. There are at least two apparent patterns in the vote count that appears to be anomalies. This is my personal observation only, but it is fairly obvious. I believe at least one other candidate was cheated of votes.
We can demand a recount if Dr. Paul so chooses. That is his decision.
Certain anomalies appeared throughout the count for several candidates. So they might have an interest in vote fraud also. The point is that I care even more about truthful elections than I care whether my candidate wins. Well, yes, naturally I want him to succeed. Got to be honest here. :)
This is just one of the problems in our country that Dr. Paul would be very much on top of as President. He is too honest to allow anything but an honest vote count for all candidates.
On Leno the other night he reminded Americans that it would be wrong to censure Mr. Romney on his religious beliefs, that it concerned him that this could happen, adding that only his issues/platform should be a basis for supporting or not supporting him. Several million people heard that message.
As usual Mr. Gardner, you are one more person who just does not get it. It is a bit like the old story one hears of brilliant or somewhat intelligent people who do not know what to do if they have a flat tire, try to change it, and lose the lug nuts. Scratching their heads in despair or panic, an insane asylum inmate comes along and suggests they use one lug nut from each of the other tire rims. “Brilliant!” But why are you in the asylum? Inmate responds, “I’m in here because I’m crazy, not stupid.”
The old newsletter story has been explained many times. The young fellow who tried to slander Dr. Paul with innuendoes also offerred not one concrete fact. Furthermore, Dr. Paul is a great admirer of MLK for his belief in peacable protesting. He is a better friend to Black Americans and the poor, and the middle class than any of the other Republicans or Democrats, because he understands the economy, monetery policy, and foreign policy are robbing them of more and more of their money, destroying the middle class, placing people deeper in poverty such that they cannot escape. He understands that our empire will soon come to an end due to the falling dollar. When that happens we will be vulnerable to attack and being conquered by another country, jsut as we have been doing for so many years. Even China could end up owning us.
He is a better friend to Israel in wanting Israel to have its sovereignty back and stop having to take orders from the US. He would end aid to them, but so would he end aid to all other foreign countries. this alone would benefit Israel since we give their enemies three times as much as we give Israel.
Jews for Ron Paul 2008
http://www.jews4ronpaul.org/advisors.html3
You and others like you need to do a serious reality check. America is on the wrong track and it is going to get a whole lot worse and much sooner than you might think. I have watched it for my entire life as it was incrementally gaining legs and it is very, very close. We must restore our Liberty and the rule of law as set down in our Constitution.
Some of the pictures below on this page are further reason we need Dr. Paul.
Mote: It is impossible to read the words on your widget and almost impossible to hear the numbers. I had to try four time.
Thank you for reading this.
January 10th, 2008 at 10:21 am
The question I have for Justin is the same one I asked seven months ago, what do we gain from making a non-major party run? hmm? What? What does 8% in New Hampshire really translate to nationally especially if independent didn’t flock to Paul’s banner? 2%, 4% What’s the point? If you think the media doesn’t pay much attention to Paul now, wait until he’s running this fall on the LP or CP ballots, then you’ll see what a media blackout really is all about. This will be especially true if Mayor Bloomberg decides to run as an independent.
Having been through that experience with Buchanan in 2000, I can assure you I don’t wish go through another exercise in futility. Yes, Paul’s bid for the GOP nomination was a longshot, you’re not telling us anything we didn’t already know Justin. But we thought it was a shot worth taking to see what would happen. I think its obvious there’s a base of between 8-10 of the vote, a in some states and in others less, within the GOP that likes Dr. Paul’s message. That’s a start. If Paul’s people work themselves into the party apparatus and another candidate comes along in the next who more articulate and better on television than Dr. Paul and if the GOP shut out of power completly, then his views will have a better chance of being adsvancing in party circles. One advantage we do have is time. Most GOP voters are old. Most Paul voters are young.
January 10th, 2008 at 12:09 pm
Remember it was 14 years between the Tea Party in 1773 and the ratification of the Consitution in 1787 (or thereabouts)
Don’t give up - if you really want to change America we need to become involved in all aspects of the system. See how Wyoming voted without a popular vote? does that really count?
Paul has more delegates than Rudy at this point as well as the vote count.
never give up - Ron has been doing this for 20 + years - most of us have only become involved in the last 9 months…
Good Job everyone
We’re All For Paul!
January 10th, 2008 at 12:14 pm
Ron Paul supporters are the only supporters that will show up on Super Tuesday enmass. Most people have never voted in a primary…until now, and they’ll be Ron Paul votes.
January 10th, 2008 at 6:17 pm
When you’re filling your car with $3 gas and buying some $2.65 a dozen eggs, remember who is running on stopping deficit spending. The war for oil is what caused prices for anything that eats grain to skyrocket. When THOSE prices rise, the fresh fruit seller raises his prices again, now you have some nice $5 a pound grapes in the market. Laugh all you want, it’s YOUR money being spent. YOU’RE the one going to pay $250 a week for groceries. Still think Ron Paul sounds like a bad idea? He’s the ONLY candidate, Republican or Democrat that is running on reducing your cost of living. Maybe you have plenty money. Me, I’m not so rich.
January 14th, 2008 at 4:58 pm
You must have missed something. The freedom movement started in this country in the 1970s when it became crystal clear to a few that the war machine was in control and that it would be un bound by a gold standard and un bound by the Constution as it invaded beople’s homes with out warrants and imprisioned non violent offenders and those who chose not to fight in Nam. The illusion started fading because people like Ron Paul started poking holes in the vail of order with their pencils and public actions. Now 10% of Americans are waking up to the great lie and it is a sign that the holes are much bigger now and so there is no end to the Revolution Ron Paul is just playing his part to lead the people who are awake to start chipping away at the lies. Soon our movement will multiply and the wall will come down. Every vote for Ron Paul is a victory. Libertarians usualy get .5% of the vote. So Ron Paul is showing a 2000% victory in the battle for freedom which we realize make take another generation to bring the Republic back to its full glory.