The “Obama Was In The Church” Meme
By Justin Gardner | Related entries in 2008 Election, Barack, Blogging, Memes, Race, ReligionWant to know why I made such a big deal when a blogger said that Obama “finally admitted that he was in Church when Wright said some of the things we saw him say on video.” ?
Here’s a comment that was posted from a random visitor to the site…
Neither myself,my family nor my friends care who now endorses Obama. He lied about being in the church when the hateful statements were made by Mr. Wright. It was a basic simple thing that showes he can’t tell the truth and he didn’t remove himself or disown this hate fullman.The youth have a problem with concentration. They love rallys, but it’s the people my age who vote. No one knows what the situation will be in November, but don’t bet the house that the young people will stay interested that long.
Now the blogger I quoted has since said that what he meant was that Obama admitted he was in Church when similar statements were made. As most of you know, Obama didn’t admit anything of the sort, but as you can see…some voters don’t even care to make this distinction. They’re simply repeating the meme that Obama “lied about being in the church when the hateful statements were made by Mr. Wright.”
We’re obviously all guilty of doing this from time to time, but just consider this a heads up…because it does matter.
This entry was posted on Saturday, March 22nd, 2008 and is filed under 2008 Election, Barack, Blogging, Memes, Race, Religion. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.
March 22nd, 2008 at 1:34 pm
When people get their news from faux news soundbites they lose the ability to understand nuance and complex thought, but those guys weren’t going to vote for Obama anyways
March 22nd, 2008 at 3:36 pm
Justin, I’m beginning to worry about your grasp of reality.
You state: Now the blogger I quoted has since said that what he meant was that Obama admitted he was in Church when similar statements were made. As most of you know, Obama didn’t admit anything of the sort…
Obama stated: “Did I know him to be an occasionally fierce critic of American domestic and foreign policy? Of course. Did I ever hear him make remarks that could be considered controversial while I sat in church? Yes.”
Are you denying he said this? or do these common English words mean something different when they hit your particular ears or when they issue from Obama’s specific mouth?
Either you are lying through your teeth, or you have completely lost it.
March 22nd, 2008 at 4:09 pm
NewsMax started all this with a lie that Obama was in church on the 22nd June(?) when they had video of the pastor (which was viciously edited to make it worse than it really was anyway).
The truth is that Obama wasn’t there then, or at any time that the quoted remarks were made. However, apparently he should have walked out or left the church anyway, but the only people walking out are Fox News anchors who (miraculously) recognize that a good man is being falsely accused.
It’s Easter, real Christians like Huckabee recognize that this is so much BS, but will it stop? No chance when there’s an agenda to push and Obama is found wanting of anything real to knock him down.
March 22nd, 2008 at 5:21 pm
Rich, nothing is inconsistent here.
Obviously I’m not denying the words Obama said in his speech, I’m simply saying that I never said I agreed that what Michael said is accurate.
Fact: Obama never said the controversial statements he heard while in Church were similar to what was said on those videos. The idea of “we saw him say on video” was added by Michael. Now, it’s certainly a more charitable interpretation than the one in the comment I highlighted, but it’s still not accurate, it’s merely an assumption.
My point here is that uncharitable characterizations of statements have consequences that we may not intend, like helping spread memes. And since we already fought the fight over how we could interpret Michael’s statement differently, I think you need to concede that if it can parsed one way by Michael, Christine and yourself, then somebody who doesn’t like Obama could possibly see it and assume Michael is saying that Obama was in the church during the YouTube Sermons.
To cybernet, I’m not going to sit here and say Wright isn’t a good man. I don’t know him and he obviously made some pretty indefensible remarks, but from everything I’ve read about him during the past week, he has a very consistent track record for helping the poor and needy, which is what Reverends should be doing if they’re worth anything. However, I do agree that what we’re going to see more videos like the one you mentioned, and at every turn we need to make sure they’re studied for their validity, and if they’re accurate, that needs to come out and if they’re not, that needs to be highlighted as well. And the same goes for anything vicious thrown at McCain. We can’t let the fringes define either candidate this time.
March 23rd, 2008 at 9:40 am
Jeff Jacoby from the Boston Globe gets it right:
No more excuses, Justin.
March 23rd, 2008 at 10:05 am
Excuse for what? Making sure the record is accurate?
Listen, it’s obvious people are going to condemn Obama for being in that Church for 20 years, and I understand why they’re doing it.
However, if people are saying that he was in the church while those videos were being made, that’s just false. At least it’s false according to Obama. If it turns out he actually was there during THOSE videos, then Obama is liar and people should judge him accordingly. Can we at least agree on that Jimmy?
One last thing…I’m sure the “millions” Jacoby talks about have, at some point, heard different people in their lives say indefensible things and not denounced and rejected them. Perhaps they’d act differently in regards to their Church, but there’s a difference between listening to somebody and agreeing with them, and that idea seems to be lost in this conversation.
March 23rd, 2008 at 10:54 am
Jimmy
You’re not exactly being fair. You “paste” an opinion piece written by a follower of Judaism about his Rabbi and synagogue and his claim that his relationship is similar – it isn’t. Anyone making that claim has improperly framed the argument, and tilted the playing field.
Wright was born in Philadelphia, went to school in Virginia (during the Jim Crowe days), and saw his only avenue for improvement through the Marine Corps and US Navy. So many of his opinions were formed from the social upheavals that happened in this country during the 1950’s and 1960’s.
Nearly every one of JW’s sermons is nothing like the two or 3 you see looped on the right wing stations – but I can only assume your research only went so far as last weeks Boston Globe story? What if Jeff Jacoby’s rabbi were Meir Hirsh – and his first exposure to Judaism was a brand of anti-zionist Judaism Meir followed? We can only assume what would be said – but it’s much closer to the argument then Jacoby initially frames in his Globe piece.
Here’s a letter Rabbi Hirsh sent to the UN January 21 of this year:
URGENT LETTER TO THE ESTEEMED SECRETARY GENERAL OF THE UNITED NATIONS, THE HONORABLE BAN-KI MOON
FROM ORTHODOX JEWS IN JERUSALEM AND WORLDWIDE ABOUT THE CURRENT ZIONIST ONSLAUGHT AGAINST THE PALESTINIANS IN GAZA
Dear Hon. Secretary-General:
It is with a heavy heart that we write you from the city of Jerusalem. For sixty years the authorities of what is mischaracterized as the “Jewish State” have been undertaking a vicious campaign of oppression and ethnic cleansing against millions of Palestinians who currently still live in historic Palestine and who are refugees from Palestine in other countires. And they have been committing all these crimes in the name of the ancient and holy Jewish religion!
For sixty years the State of Israel been desecrating and violating our sacred religion! For sixty years the State of Israel has been flaunting international law and United Nation General Assembly and Security Council resolutions! For sixty years they have been bringing Mankind to the edge of world war, claiming to do so in the name of Judaism!
Even today, as we write this letter, the Zionist regime is waging an unrelenting war of starvation and suffering against the people of Gaza. In the name of the sacred values of the Jewish religion we cry out to the international community and especially the great powers and the United Nations: Please use your skills to finally stop the vicious and insane campaigns of the State of Israel against the Palestinians whose suffering worsens from one day to the next under the heavy hand of occupation and oppression, ethnic cleansing and discrimination!
Mr. Secretary-General, we beseech you to use your offices to work with world leaders to stop this mad campaign of collective punishment and oppression! Our holy religion teaches us values that are the utter opposite of those of the State of Israel: we are taught by our Torah to live in harmony and brotherhood, friendship and neighborliness.
The State of Israel is trying to use its military power to preserve its ethnocracy and is demanding that the world community watch silently as they continue to hammer the Palestinian People year after year with the most sophisticated weapons of war. This cannot go on any longer! The state-sponsored terrorism and collective punishment practiced by the State of Israel must be condemned and stopped!
We fervently pray that G-d guide world leaders to tke the necessary action to stop the suffering of the Palestinian People, rein in the State of Israel, restore the full rights of the Palestinians throughout their homeland in historic Palestine, and thereby create peace not only in the Holy Land, but also throughout the world. The world cannot stand by and watch the State of Israel commit these terrible crimes!
Thank you kindly for your attention to this urgent matter,
Yours truly,
Rabbi Meir Hirsch
Neturei Karta Palestine”
See my point Jimmy? Can you imagine what would happen if the media started to focus on religious leaders and all the bull-shit they spew in order to determine someone’s character. To attribute the crap and vitriol of a religious person to someone other than the man or woman who said it is dishonest, disingenuous, and in some circles even evil. Please don’t frame arguments with someone else’s parameters – it doesn’t lend itself well to public discourse.
March 25th, 2008 at 1:11 pm
It is amazing to me that folks can’t get off the whole “why did Obama stay with the church for 20 yearsâ€. Two or three snippets of videos are released of sermons whose full context nobody bothers to hear, whose theology nobody bothers to examine and a church whose bond and fellowship we condemn just because it does not fit into what is considered mainstream Christianity.
Personally I condemn the news media. I can almost understand why they choose to release and distribute the videos. It’s how they make the bucks. But where is the follow up investigation? Where are the full videos? Where are the interviews and the examination of all the good Trinity has done for the community? What happened to journalistic integrity and the desire to uncover the truth?
It is only fair that the airwaves be bombarded with the 20 plus years history of Trinity, just as we have barraged with Wright’s so-called “rhetoric of hatredâ€.
Sorry, just had to get this out my system… Keith