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	<title>Comments on: Clinton &#8220;Claims&#8221; Popular Vote Lead, ABC Refutes</title>
	<atom:link href="http://donklephant.com/2008/04/23/clinton-claims-popular-vote-lead-abc-refutes/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://donklephant.com/2008/04/23/clinton-claims-popular-vote-lead-abc-refutes/</link>
	<description>Big Teeth. Huge Ass. Surprisingly Reasonable.</description>
	<pubDate>Sat, 30 Aug 2008 13:06:21 +0000</pubDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.1</generator>
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		<title>By: The Bad Man</title>
		<link>http://donklephant.com/2008/04/23/clinton-claims-popular-vote-lead-abc-refutes/#comment-397012</link>
		<dc:creator>The Bad Man</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 22:29:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://donklephant.com/?p=5332#comment-397012</guid>
		<description>The Clinton Manifesto:

1. If the game doesn't suit you, change the rules.
2. If the truth doesn't suite you, lie (often).
3. If you get caught in a lie, it's no big deal.
4. If it's inevitable that your opponent is going to checkmate you in a few moves, do a fumble, and knock the table over.  You won't win, but he won't either... And then tell everyone that you were actually about to win the game.
5. If you find yourself in second place in a long race, try to convince your opponent to let you win the race for the both of you.
6. Personal integrity is for the weak-minded and the faint of heart.
7. Ethics? Oh - That's the good stuff you do/say/create in front of the camera that can't or won't be fact checked.
8. If you can't best your opponent in a particular area, criticize him for being skilled in that way. Don't try to improve your own skill set.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Clinton Manifesto:</p>
<p>1. If the game doesn&#8217;t suit you, change the rules.<br />
2. If the truth doesn&#8217;t suite you, lie (often).<br />
3. If you get caught in a lie, it&#8217;s no big deal.<br />
4. If it&#8217;s inevitable that your opponent is going to checkmate you in a few moves, do a fumble, and knock the table over.  You won&#8217;t win, but he won&#8217;t either&#8230; And then tell everyone that you were actually about to win the game.<br />
5. If you find yourself in second place in a long race, try to convince your opponent to let you win the race for the both of you.<br />
6. Personal integrity is for the weak-minded and the faint of heart.<br />
7. Ethics? Oh - That&#8217;s the good stuff you do/say/create in front of the camera that can&#8217;t or won&#8217;t be fact checked.<br />
8. If you can&#8217;t best your opponent in a particular area, criticize him for being skilled in that way. Don&#8217;t try to improve your own skill set.</p>
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		<title>By: mw</title>
		<link>http://donklephant.com/2008/04/23/clinton-claims-popular-vote-lead-abc-refutes/#comment-396996</link>
		<dc:creator>mw</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 20:32:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://donklephant.com/?p=5332#comment-396996</guid>
		<description>Paul,
Lets start with this: 15,095,663 real live registered Democratic and Independent American voters walked into a voting booth and cast a vote for Hillary Clinton in elections that were certified by their state.  Which ones do you want to disenfranchise again?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Paul,<br />
Lets start with this: 15,095,663 real live registered Democratic and Independent American voters walked into a voting booth and cast a vote for Hillary Clinton in elections that were certified by their state.  Which ones do you want to disenfranchise again?</p>
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		<title>By: paul</title>
		<link>http://donklephant.com/2008/04/23/clinton-claims-popular-vote-lead-abc-refutes/#comment-396989</link>
		<dc:creator>paul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 18:38:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://donklephant.com/?p=5332#comment-396989</guid>
		<description>MW :  Not my fault. I just prefer to deal in reality.

me too, when do you want to start?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>MW :  Not my fault. I just prefer to deal in reality.</p>
<p>me too, when do you want to start?</p>
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		<title>By: mw</title>
		<link>http://donklephant.com/2008/04/23/clinton-claims-popular-vote-lead-abc-refutes/#comment-396971</link>
		<dc:creator>mw</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 14:19:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://donklephant.com/?p=5332#comment-396971</guid>
		<description>mitoe,
Actually, I am a good loser, but I am a really bad winner. It really is not my fault that Obama supporters prefer to pick and choose the Dem nomination rules they want to follow - They like the disenfranchising FL, MI, and TX caucus rules, but don't like the superdelegate rules. I like all the rules. It is not my fault that Obama supporters don't like the &lt;b&gt;fact&lt;/b&gt; that more Democrats have voted for Clinton than Obama. Not my fault. I just prefer to deal in reality.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>mitoe,<br />
Actually, I am a good loser, but I am a really bad winner. It really is not my fault that Obama supporters prefer to pick and choose the Dem nomination rules they want to follow - They like the disenfranchising FL, MI, and TX caucus rules, but don&#8217;t like the superdelegate rules. I like all the rules. It is not my fault that Obama supporters don&#8217;t like the <b>fact</b> that more Democrats have voted for Clinton than Obama. Not my fault. I just prefer to deal in reality.</p>
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		<title>By: Brian P</title>
		<link>http://donklephant.com/2008/04/23/clinton-claims-popular-vote-lead-abc-refutes/#comment-396967</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian P</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 13:31:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://donklephant.com/?p=5332#comment-396967</guid>
		<description>MW:  " It strikes me that just points to very poor judgment on the part of the Obama campaign".

Speaking of facts, it's a fact that Clinton signed a pledge not to "participate" in the Michigan primary.  Obama signed the same petition.  That's why he removed his name from the ballot.  She, however, lied and kept her name on the ballot.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>MW:  &#8221; It strikes me that just points to very poor judgment on the part of the Obama campaign&#8221;.</p>
<p>Speaking of facts, it&#8217;s a fact that Clinton signed a pledge not to &#8220;participate&#8221; in the Michigan primary.  Obama signed the same petition.  That&#8217;s why he removed his name from the ballot.  She, however, lied and kept her name on the ballot.</p>
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		<title>By: TerenceC</title>
		<link>http://donklephant.com/2008/04/23/clinton-claims-popular-vote-lead-abc-refutes/#comment-396959</link>
		<dc:creator>TerenceC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 12:06:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://donklephant.com/?p=5332#comment-396959</guid>
		<description>55says

"It's dumb, and it's vile." And it's probably the biggest reason so many people are tired of the Clintons and their misdirection, dishonesty, and double talk ....politics at it's finest.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>55says</p>
<p>&#8220;It&#8217;s dumb, and it&#8217;s vile.&#8221; And it&#8217;s probably the biggest reason so many people are tired of the Clintons and their misdirection, dishonesty, and double talk &#8230;.politics at it&#8217;s finest.</p>
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		<title>By: Woeful</title>
		<link>http://donklephant.com/2008/04/23/clinton-claims-popular-vote-lead-abc-refutes/#comment-396939</link>
		<dc:creator>Woeful</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 10:17:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://donklephant.com/?p=5332#comment-396939</guid>
		<description>OK... What about the caucus states Hillary?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OK&#8230; What about the caucus states Hillary?</p>
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		<title>By: mitoe</title>
		<link>http://donklephant.com/2008/04/23/clinton-claims-popular-vote-lead-abc-refutes/#comment-396933</link>
		<dc:creator>mitoe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 05:18:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://donklephant.com/?p=5332#comment-396933</guid>
		<description>mw sounds like a sore loser :/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>mw sounds like a sore loser :/</p>
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		<title>By: 55</title>
		<link>http://donklephant.com/2008/04/23/clinton-claims-popular-vote-lead-abc-refutes/#comment-396932</link>
		<dc:creator>55</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 05:02:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://donklephant.com/?p=5332#comment-396932</guid>
		<description>"Well this election, you know, it's not going to count for anything." - Hillary in re Michigan. 

And yes, she did say anything. That means popular votes. 

After she lost Iowa, she was claiming it's all about the delegates. When that went out the window, it became about superdelegates. Now that her lead is about to evaporate, it's about popular votes minus caucus states plus states that in her own words don't count for anything. 

It's dumb, and it's vile.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Well this election, you know, it&#8217;s not going to count for anything.&#8221; - Hillary in re Michigan. </p>
<p>And yes, she did say anything. That means popular votes. </p>
<p>After she lost Iowa, she was claiming it&#8217;s all about the delegates. When that went out the window, it became about superdelegates. Now that her lead is about to evaporate, it&#8217;s about popular votes minus caucus states plus states that in her own words don&#8217;t count for anything. </p>
<p>It&#8217;s dumb, and it&#8217;s vile.</p>
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		<title>By: mw</title>
		<link>http://donklephant.com/2008/04/23/clinton-claims-popular-vote-lead-abc-refutes/#comment-396929</link>
		<dc:creator>mw</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 04:08:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://donklephant.com/?p=5332#comment-396929</guid>
		<description>Was your second grader a registered Democratic or independent voter in a certified Democratic primary or caucus? If so, then yes, your second grader was among the 15,095,663 who voted for Clinton.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Was your second grader a registered Democratic or independent voter in a certified Democratic primary or caucus? If so, then yes, your second grader was among the 15,095,663 who voted for Clinton.</p>
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		<title>By: Smitty</title>
		<link>http://donklephant.com/2008/04/23/clinton-claims-popular-vote-lead-abc-refutes/#comment-396921</link>
		<dc:creator>Smitty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 02:23:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://donklephant.com/?p=5332#comment-396921</guid>
		<description>My second grader voted in his class at school -- did the Clinton campaign count those votes, too?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My second grader voted in his class at school &#8212; did the Clinton campaign count those votes, too?</p>
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		<title>By: mw</title>
		<link>http://donklephant.com/2008/04/23/clinton-claims-popular-vote-lead-abc-refutes/#comment-396920</link>
		<dc:creator>mw</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 02:10:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://donklephant.com/?p=5332#comment-396920</guid>
		<description>Lets talk about "facts".  It is a fact that Clinton, and Obama, and other Dem candidates agreed to not campaign and not count the MI and FL primaries for purposes of allocating pledged delegates. Stipulated. And as a result, Obama has a big pledged delegate lead and will keep it to the convention. 

However, since Obama has failed to win on the basis of pledged delegates, and cannot win on the basis of pledged delegates, and has failed to deliver knockout blows in NH, OH, TX, and PA, pledged delegates are not a determinative factor. He has another chance to deliver a knockout blow - In Indiana. If he wins Indana, Clinton is done.  However, if he fails again, then pledged delegates are not the game. Superdelegates are the game. Arguments to superdelegates are the game. And there are no Democratic Party rules agreed about what arguments can be made to superdelegates.  

In that context, it is perfectly reasonable for Hillary Clinton to count every registered Democrat who voted for her in a certified election. And when she does that, it is an indisputable FACT, that 15,095,663 people voted for Hillary Clinton. That is a fact, and cannot be argued.A True Fact. And when you add up the people to voted for Obama, it is a smaller number. True Fact.  Can't be argued as a fact. By the time we get to Puerto Rico, the Clinton advantage in this arithmetic will be larger. 

It can be farily argued, that it was not fair since Obama's name was not on the Michigan ballot, as it was withdrawn at their own request.  This is also a true fact. It strikes me that just points to very poor judgment on the part of the Obama campaign. They had an opportunity to correct  that bad judgment, and support a re-vote in Michigan. Instead, the Obama campaign obstructed the re-vote in Michigan as was supported by the Clinton campaign. Another very bad judgment, on the part of the Obama campaign - leaving Clinton free and justified to make this argument to the superdelegates.  This is a self-inflicted would by the Obama campaign. Because it is simply true that more people have voted for Clinton than Obama over the entire campaign season.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lets talk about &#8220;facts&#8221;.  It is a fact that Clinton, and Obama, and other Dem candidates agreed to not campaign and not count the MI and FL primaries for purposes of allocating pledged delegates. Stipulated. And as a result, Obama has a big pledged delegate lead and will keep it to the convention. </p>
<p>However, since Obama has failed to win on the basis of pledged delegates, and cannot win on the basis of pledged delegates, and has failed to deliver knockout blows in NH, OH, TX, and PA, pledged delegates are not a determinative factor. He has another chance to deliver a knockout blow - In Indiana. If he wins Indana, Clinton is done.  However, if he fails again, then pledged delegates are not the game. Superdelegates are the game. Arguments to superdelegates are the game. And there are no Democratic Party rules agreed about what arguments can be made to superdelegates.  </p>
<p>In that context, it is perfectly reasonable for Hillary Clinton to count every registered Democrat who voted for her in a certified election. And when she does that, it is an indisputable FACT, that 15,095,663 people voted for Hillary Clinton. That is a fact, and cannot be argued.A True Fact. And when you add up the people to voted for Obama, it is a smaller number. True Fact.  Can&#8217;t be argued as a fact. By the time we get to Puerto Rico, the Clinton advantage in this arithmetic will be larger. </p>
<p>It can be farily argued, that it was not fair since Obama&#8217;s name was not on the Michigan ballot, as it was withdrawn at their own request.  This is also a true fact. It strikes me that just points to very poor judgment on the part of the Obama campaign. They had an opportunity to correct  that bad judgment, and support a re-vote in Michigan. Instead, the Obama campaign obstructed the re-vote in Michigan as was supported by the Clinton campaign. Another very bad judgment, on the part of the Obama campaign - leaving Clinton free and justified to make this argument to the superdelegates.  This is a self-inflicted would by the Obama campaign. Because it is simply true that more people have voted for Clinton than Obama over the entire campaign season.</p>
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		<title>By: Bahamut</title>
		<link>http://donklephant.com/2008/04/23/clinton-claims-popular-vote-lead-abc-refutes/#comment-396901</link>
		<dc:creator>Bahamut</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Apr 2008 22:41:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://donklephant.com/?p=5332#comment-396901</guid>
		<description>What is ABC thinking?  You proposing using facts to make a point?  This is... so unamerican.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What is ABC thinking?  You proposing using facts to make a point?  This is&#8230; so unamerican.</p>
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