7 Responses to “CNN’s Rick Sanchez Vs. Joe The Plumber”

1. Honestly Says:
   November 4th, 2008 at 5:25 pm

   I think it’s sad that this man has had to face so much scrutiny. However, he is often brought in as the GOP supporter version of the everyman. His nickname is invoked as a salt of the earth taxpayer that will suffer under an Obama Presidency.

   The day he asked his question, he already knew his answer.

   Never mind that his entire premise to his question is a lie. If Joe the Plumber does represent the struggling middle-class everyman, then it represents how people assume things with titles they don’t fully understand, and then live and vote by those convictions.

   It true that it’s hard to fully understand anything in the flurry of political debates. But what should have been a healthy debate on whether supply side economic works better then progressive taxation, instead became a smear called socialism.

2. mark Says:
   November 4th, 2008 at 5:52 pm

   why does any credible journalist, or outlet, bother with this idiot? Really, is he relevant? Does he have anything intelligent to say, really? Of course not.

3. tom Says:
   November 4th, 2008 at 9:31 pm

   What a bafoon of an interviewer. We have a guy who asks a candidate a question in public. He challenges the answer and now gets grilled about his own personal status. Perhaps the problem was that what Joe was talking about was beyond the capacity of most of Rick’s audience and thus, the host chose to attack on personal themes. Gee, if that’s where the capacity to understand the issues at hand is, then by all means – lets let this annointed group of change agents win a resounding victory and have their kick at the can. After a solid round of tax and spend we’ll no doubt start to hear how much worse the situation left by the previous adminstration was and how it’ll take much longer to get out of it. But meanwhile, we’ll continue to support those who don’t earn enough to pay taxes and tax the heck out of those who actually do provide the working capital to drive an economy out of a pull back and/or recession. We’ve got what everyone has wished for, so let us now see where this ride takes us…

4. for parity Says:
   November 5th, 2008 at 10:20 am

   My note to Sanchez:

   My goodness you pounded on this guy, Joe – a man given the opportunity to speak (because of Senator Obama’s visit to his neighborhood); a man who perhaps dares to imagine to dream of the opportunity which Senator (Pres. Elect now) Obama promises to work for.

   However, you (with the entire national media in tow) were completely focused on the wrong man here. Joe was absolutely correct – you’re vetting the wrong guy. If we are so damn interested in the truth here, then why did we not vet Senator Obama on his statements to Joe. Obama did not tell the truth – that is number one below. And then I’ll follow up with an even bigger fear tactic pushed by Senator Biden a few days later which also was based on misrepresenting the truth – of which our national media also left on the table untouched.

   1.) Right off the top, Obama just out and out lied to Joe the Plumber. Obama said:

   “we haven’t given a [tax] break to folks who make less.”

   Yes “we” did. Lots of them.

   For the record, the Bush administration, with congress, did in fact give poorer and middle class working folks numerous and significant tax breaks (** Listed below). Obama and Biden are free to argue for them or against them – but should not be allowed to lie straight out to the American public and suggest that they do not exist. Obama/Biden must be questioned on these misrepresentations. The voters have a right to expect that our media will not just sit and let that remain on the table as the final say.

   For the record (and leaving the top end tax cuts off the table here – a separate discussion), the Obama/Biden camp continued to press that we should return the middle and lower income class workers to the tax policy of the Clinton years – as if they would be better off then? No, the Bush tax cuts lowered the tax liability of these two classes – from where they were when Clinton left office – a considerable amount more than Senator Obama’s new tax cuts will do. If the Bush tax cuts for the middle and lower class are allowed to expire, and Obama delivers the tax cuts to these two groups, as he has proposed, these two groups will be faced with a higher tax liability – hence, will have a tougher time getting ahead – than in the present moment.

   2.) And a few days later, Senator Biden claimed [to Barbara West]:

   ..they [Bush] have devastated the middle class. We, for the first time since the 1920’s – 1 % of the American people make 21% of all the income in America. That wasn’t the way before George Bush became president.

   Bottom line. False – not only false, but what a stretch of the entire two periods of time between two administrations. This wealth gap exploded during the 90’s under Bill Clinton. Hit 21% (+/-) in 2000. Here’s the backup:

   Let’s look at this great misrepresentation in two ways. First it’s rather convenient that the MSM stood on it’s toes back in June, 2005, NY Times economic writer David Kay Johnston wrote a piece attacking the Bush tax cuts. The article, “Richest Are Leaving Even the Rich Far Behind,” used data illustrating how the rich got richer during the Clinton years, but then the rest of the media ran with the view that it was all about Bush. Now for the record, I did discuss this with David, and he did concur with my view.

   http://www.nytimes.com/imagepages/2005/06/05/national/06HYPERA_GRAPHIC.html

   Look carefully at the chart — Not since the 20’s roared — at when this great rise in wealth of the super rich occurred. The president here was Bill Clinton, not George Bush. Then look at when this rising trend ended. And, let’s not get twisted that one is about the top 1% and the other is the top 0.1% – as it’s the same story for both.

   Now. Biden said specifically, “first time since the 1920’s – 1 % of the American people make 21% of all the income..”

   Well, technically he may be right, but only by a statistical fraction, 0.19% – this is simply a political sales job. From 1993 to 2000 the top 1%’s income rose from 13.79% to 20.81% (I’d call that 21% – then) of all the income. Imagine the power of the proper follow up question to Biden here;

   Senator: Think about what you’ve claimed. Your charge presents an atmosphere of horrific economic class war by the Bush administration; however the data clearly shows that if indeed this is the concern of the Democratic party, then should we not have been in a state of civil unrest during the prior Clinton administration as we watched this great wealth divide go from 13% to 14%, to 15%, to 16%, to 17%, to 18%, to 19%, to 20% and finally to 21% in 2000?

   Enter Presidennt Bush. By 2003, the top 1%’s share of the total income had dropped to 16.77%. Latest data I have does show that by 2006, it’s up to 22.06%. (*source; Gerald Prante, summarizing IRS data – July 2008) – This would be the same data that Biden is using.

   So during the Clinton era, this “horrible thing” increased by a large amount; while under Bush it’s managed in 7 years to pop up a point. So let’s love Clinton for it, and hate Bush for it. How about, “let’s challenge the lies – and educate the voters – the readers.”

   So you attack Joe the Plumber – holding him to a higher standard – while giving Senator’s Obama and Biden a complete pass on their divisive misstatements of truth to the American people.

   An extra on the same issues: Want to look at how CEO’s vs. worker bees faired under Bush compared to Clinton? Once again look closely at the chart – where is the anger at the Clinton years – and the celebration of the end of the Clinton years?:

   Average CEO to Average Worker Pay Ratio

   http://www.aflcio.org/corporatewatch/paywatch/pay/images/2006_trend_chart.gif

   Note: the last data year in the chart is 2005. The ratio for 2007 has continued to drop to 344. And something tells me it will have dropped further in 2008 – just a sneaking suspicion.

   Additionally, there are several enormous economic items (affecting the election outcome) out there that are severely hurting the ability of the American people to understand our economic cycles. The Obama/Biden camp misrepresented them regularly, as fuel for divineness. They are not true representations of recent history, by any sense of the imagination.

   - Clinton did not leave Bush a wonderful and warm purring economy. Bush inherited a crash, with almost every economic indicator long reversing long before the fall, 2000 election. (data and graphs easily available – from yours truly)

   - The $5 Trillion surplus – see above, was only a silly “projected surplus,” based on the late 90’s bubble continuing for ten more years. Any revisit to year end 2000 – shows that the surplus was out the window for the next president.

   Now Rick. Arm the American people with the truth on these issues and watch how they suddenly find themselves empowered, as they will then begin to understand how the economy works, to intellectually demand change.

   In the meantime, you should be ashamed of your smear job on Joe. What a waste of our time.

   **… significant tax breaks; all middle and lower tax rates were lowered, with the 15% lower bracket being cut to 10% (a 50% reduction); child tax credit was doubled; and the marriage penalty tax trap was fixed – and it helped a ton. In 2001 they received a tax rebate. In 2008, for goodness sakes, once again, we are given a tax rebate, a larger one, a part of a stimulus package. Millions of lower and middle class workers invest in the markets and did in fact benefit from lower capital gains tax and lower dividend tax rates. The capital gains tax reductions also extend to the sale of rental property and to the sale of a small businesses, creating a much needed break for all, including the middle class.

5. Carl Folk Says:
   November 6th, 2008 at 6:34 pm

   Sorry guys but this man wanted to have the spot light on him. He thought he would become an American hero by giving the gotcha to Obama. If he is soo principled why hasn’t he paid his debts ! The republican party should have checked this guy out better before they thrust him on the screen.He is no where near making 250K, he was not buying a business and basically was a fictitious character .

6. Donklephant » Blog Archive » Donklephant Mentioned On CNN By Rick Sanchez Says:
   November 6th, 2008 at 7:12 pm

   [...] apparently referenced this post about his confrontation with Joe the [...]

7. Avinash_Tyagi Says:
   November 6th, 2008 at 7:30 pm

   So many bitter rethuglicans crying out their tears, its the most lovely music i’ve ever heard

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