General Pace: Homosexual Acts Are Immoral
By Justin Gardner | Related entries in Military, Sexuality
Oh boy…
“I believe homosexual acts between two individuals are immoral and that we should not condone immoral acts,” Pace said in a wide-ranging discussion with Tribune editors and reporters in Chicago. “I do not believe the United States is well served by a policy that says it is OK to be immoral in any way.
Okay Peter, but what about homosexual acts between three or more individuals?
“As an individual, I would not want [acceptance of gay behavior] to be our policy, just like I would not want it to be our policy that if we were to find out that so-and-so was sleeping with somebody else’s wife, that we would just look the other way, which we do not. We prosecute that kind of immoral behavior,” Pace said.
Still, this seems to be in line with what many in the military think…
Charles Moskos, a military sociologist at Northwestern University who was instrumental in helping the Pentagon craft the “don’t ask, don’t tell” law, said it is unusual for a top commander to use morality as a justification for the policy. But he said he has repeatedly heard enlisted members use that reasoning when opposing gays in the military.“With the enlisted, it’s a question of cohesion, but morality is something they always bring up,” said Moskos, who declined to comment specifically on Pace’s remarks.
I wonder if there’s a correlation between having a religious upbringing and serving in the military. Anybody have any data?
This entry was posted on Tuesday, March 13th, 2007 and is filed under Military, Sexuality. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.
March 13th, 2007 at 10:54 am
The Army offers demographic details on a web site at http://www.armyg1.army.mil/hr/demographics.asp, I presume the other services have similar reports. In 2005 active duty Army personnel were 51% Protestant, 21% Catholic, 2% Other, and 26% Not Specified. My subjective opinion from my time in the Navy some decades ago is that that religion – primarily the Southern Baptist variety – is a built-in part of the military culture.
March 13th, 2007 at 12:53 pm
Gays in the military have one privilege I didn’t have. They get to serve with the sex of their choice.
When I was drafted, if they had said I could serve with the women, and the only condition was that I could never show any sexual desires toward any of them, everything would be OK. I would sleep in women’s quarters, shower with them, and be in constant contact with them, and I could go buck naked as long as I never showed any sexual arousal.
After I had been at a command for some time, there would be a few who I could give a nod or wink, and on our time off, we would get us a room at some motel and fuck each other’s brains out.
Of course, there would be some sweet thing I just couldn’t keep my hands off, and after having too much to drink at some bar, I’d make a pass at her. She would come back to the command and tell them, and I would get kicked out for being a heterosexual.
If they had let me do that and didn’t get kicked out, I’ll still be in the military today.
March 13th, 2007 at 1:23 pm
Gays serve openly in the military in Argentina, Australia, Austria, The Bahamas, Belgium, Bulgaria, Canada, Colombia, Croatia, Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Finland, France, Germany, Hungary, Ireland, Israel, Italy, Lithuania, Luxembourg, The Netherlands, New Zealand, Norway, Peru, Poland, Portugal, Romania, Slovenia, South Africa, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, Taiwan, Thailand and United Kingdom.
Gays can’t serve openly in the military in countries like Brazil, Cuba, Egypt, Iran, North Korea, Philippines, Saudi Arabia, Syria, United States of America, Venezuela, Yemen and many of the remaining oppressive regimes in the world which have laws against homosexuality.
We are not in good company.
March 13th, 2007 at 2:10 pm
Thanks fot the extra post, Justin. I will save it for future reference.
For a high ranking officer to stick his foot in his mouth & refuse to apologize is, at least, being honest about his beliefs. At least one of his personal beliefs is false. It is not a criminal act to sleep with your neighbor’s spouse, at least in Florida or Michigan. And if that is true in the military & enforced, there probably would not have been enough soldiers to invade Iraq.
March 13th, 2007 at 3:46 pm
You should go ahead and add that the United States essentially provides the defense for all the countries in the first group.
March 13th, 2007 at 4:27 pm
And I’m sure they feel wonderfully comfortable in our “defense” considering our remarkable track record in Iraq and Afghanistan.
March 13th, 2007 at 7:21 pm
The military and Christianity have some important things in common. Both emphasize a purpose and service to an ideal greater than self interest. Both have rigid rules of conduct. A moral code is important. As strange as it sounds, you wouldn’t want soldiers with loaded weapons running around without a strong code of conduct.
When I was in the service during the Vietnam era, I don’t remember too many Christians. I do remember a whole bunch of rowdy, drunk or stoned young soldiers.
March 14th, 2007 at 11:00 am
It is not a criminal act to sleep with your neighbor’s spouse, at least in Florida or Michigan.
It is a crime for military personnel regardless of where they are located – Article 134 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice specifically makes adultery illegal. The maximum penalty includes being imprisoned for up to a year.
March 14th, 2007 at 1:58 pm
Thanks General Pace for calling a spade a spade….it’s about time someone had the guts to be honest….
March 17th, 2007 at 10:06 am
Hmm…a strong code of conduct, like the one that allows soldiers to shoot up a building full of civilians, rape young local girls, torture people in a prison they run…etc, etc, etc…
Incidentally, whether or not adultery is against the code of conduct, I’m willing to bet it happens a hell of a lot more in the military than homosexual conduct. How many times do you think soldiers go hire hookers when they’re on furlough? Remember, most of the privates and such are 18-22 year old boys with no spouse…solo action can only take you so far at that age. Hell, probably a lot of the straight ones love having gay men in their units…a blowjob is a blowjob when the lights are off…
March 19th, 2007 at 11:29 pm
I think that General Pace had every right to say what he wanted to say as any other American in this country. We can not become so much a a PC fanatic, that we forget the right to freedom of speech. General Pace did nothing wrong. When we starting denouncing, declaring war on any individual in this country in or out of uniform, then what kind of country are we or have we all ready become totally intolerant of others opininons that don’t sound like our own. Let us all keep in mind this is America, we are not living in Iran, Pakistan, Iraq, China, Syria, Cuba, etc. or any other country that doesn’t let it’s citizens speak honestly and openly without fear of reprisal. So let’s agree to diasgree, if we don’t share another individuals views, but most of all let us not try, hang, and execute someone in the court of public opinion if the view is not popular or the soup du jour of the month. Remember we as Americans are supposed to not only have pride in our committment to freedom of speech, but also serve as the leader to the rest of the world iin freedom and democracy. I say keep General Pace in his position and let a real man say what he morally feels as only as real man can.