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	<title>Comments on: AMA Delegate In Obama Witch Doctor Flap</title>
	<atom:link href="http://donklephant.com/2009/07/24/ama-delegate-in-obama-witch-doctor-flap/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://donklephant.com/2009/07/24/ama-delegate-in-obama-witch-doctor-flap/</link>
	<description>Big Teeth. Huge Ass. Surprisingly Reasonable.</description>
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		<title>By: lifediva</title>
		<link>http://donklephant.com/2009/07/24/ama-delegate-in-obama-witch-doctor-flap/comment-page-1/#comment-532285</link>
		<dc:creator>lifediva</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Aug 2009 21:32:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://donklephant.com/?p=15838#comment-532285</guid>
		<description>Of course they&#039;re racists!  None of us whites are perfect regarding racial attitudes, because we didn&#039;t grow up in a world of perfect race relations and have baggage from the past. But I have a lot of conservative &quot;friends&quot; and acquaintances and am just blown away sometimes by the racist comments that they are willing to voice in polite society, apparently in complete ignorance that those beliefs are not mainstream or socially acceptable anymore.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Of course they&#8217;re racists!  None of us whites are perfect regarding racial attitudes, because we didn&#8217;t grow up in a world of perfect race relations and have baggage from the past. But I have a lot of conservative &#8220;friends&#8221; and acquaintances and am just blown away sometimes by the racist comments that they are willing to voice in polite society, apparently in complete ignorance that those beliefs are not mainstream or socially acceptable anymore.</p>
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		<title>By: Justin Timberwolf</title>
		<link>http://donklephant.com/2009/07/24/ama-delegate-in-obama-witch-doctor-flap/comment-page-1/#comment-532196</link>
		<dc:creator>Justin Timberwolf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Aug 2009 17:59:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://donklephant.com/?p=15838#comment-532196</guid>
		<description>I think it&#039;s indicative of who is actually driving this debate and where their priorities lie. Here&#039;s a guy who&#039;s become rich under the current health care system, like most members of the AMA have, and he doesn&#039;t want his slice of the pie to be diminished. That&#039;s understandable to me, even if I disagree with the largeness of the slice that he already has.

The question for these interests is how to get a broader section of the population to get on board, which will naturally require getting those who would actually benefit from rocking the boat at the AMA and insurance lobby&#039;s expense. The answer lies in this kind of stuff, which excites the vocal, no-nothing fringe/hardcore base, just as the Bush-as-Hitler stuff riled up the Democratic base in 2004. This, obviously, is more provocative since it adds a racial element, which has ALWAYS been a reliable fear-mongering tool in this country. 

Most Americans realized that we were horribly off-track last November, but getting them to see that &quot;change&quot; is more than a campaign slogan, that it requires ACTUAL change, is a harder sale for the Dems. Meanwhile, all the opposition party has to do is play the role of active resistance, exploiting that fear of policies we haven&#039;t really tried. It&#039;s working, and like any good propaganda, subtlety is not part of the equation. 

I think the good news is that if the Dems can actually hammer out some effective policy, this stuff will become more and more obviously the work of the interest groups and the paranoid fringe. But nuance is tough.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it&#8217;s indicative of who is actually driving this debate and where their priorities lie. Here&#8217;s a guy who&#8217;s become rich under the current health care system, like most members of the AMA have, and he doesn&#8217;t want his slice of the pie to be diminished. That&#8217;s understandable to me, even if I disagree with the largeness of the slice that he already has.</p>
<p>The question for these interests is how to get a broader section of the population to get on board, which will naturally require getting those who would actually benefit from rocking the boat at the AMA and insurance lobby&#8217;s expense. The answer lies in this kind of stuff, which excites the vocal, no-nothing fringe/hardcore base, just as the Bush-as-Hitler stuff riled up the Democratic base in 2004. This, obviously, is more provocative since it adds a racial element, which has ALWAYS been a reliable fear-mongering tool in this country. </p>
<p>Most Americans realized that we were horribly off-track last November, but getting them to see that &#8220;change&#8221; is more than a campaign slogan, that it requires ACTUAL change, is a harder sale for the Dems. Meanwhile, all the opposition party has to do is play the role of active resistance, exploiting that fear of policies we haven&#8217;t really tried. It&#8217;s working, and like any good propaganda, subtlety is not part of the equation. </p>
<p>I think the good news is that if the Dems can actually hammer out some effective policy, this stuff will become more and more obviously the work of the interest groups and the paranoid fringe. But nuance is tough.</p>
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		<title>By: Tully</title>
		<link>http://donklephant.com/2009/07/24/ama-delegate-in-obama-witch-doctor-flap/comment-page-1/#comment-524068</link>
		<dc:creator>Tully</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Jul 2009 19:23:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://donklephant.com/?p=15838#comment-524068</guid>
		<description>Point of trivia: The underlying image looks SE Asian or perhaps Amazonian to me. 

&lt;i&gt;You instantly lose any credibility as a reasonable proponant of an argument with crap like this. &lt;/i&gt;

With the general public, yes. And yes, I think it&#039;s somewhat racist. But the underlying non-racist part of the message -- that the proposed health care &quot;reforms&quot; will lower the quality of medical care -- is effective. But that point could have been made just as effectively (and has been, in many places) without such imagery. 

&lt;i&gt;makes me wonder how much actual real racism out there. Color me naive, but I thought we were getting beyond that. &lt;/i&gt;

We are as far as it&#039;s humanly possible, but that&#039;s a big gap considering the human tendency to hate the Other. Racism tends to be ascribed to only one side of the political spectrum, though it truly knows no such bounds. As Ted Rall and Jane Hamsher have ably demonstrated.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Point of trivia: The underlying image looks SE Asian or perhaps Amazonian to me. </p>
<p><i>You instantly lose any credibility as a reasonable proponant of an argument with crap like this. </i></p>
<p>With the general public, yes. And yes, I think it&#8217;s somewhat racist. But the underlying non-racist part of the message &#8212; that the proposed health care &#8220;reforms&#8221; will lower the quality of medical care &#8212; is effective. But that point could have been made just as effectively (and has been, in many places) without such imagery. </p>
<p><i>makes me wonder how much actual real racism out there. Color me naive, but I thought we were getting beyond that. </i></p>
<p>We are as far as it&#8217;s humanly possible, but that&#8217;s a big gap considering the human tendency to hate the Other. Racism tends to be ascribed to only one side of the political spectrum, though it truly knows no such bounds. As Ted Rall and Jane Hamsher have ably demonstrated.</p>
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		<title>By: Justin Gardner</title>
		<link>http://donklephant.com/2009/07/24/ama-delegate-in-obama-witch-doctor-flap/comment-page-1/#comment-523966</link>
		<dc:creator>Justin Gardner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Jul 2009 17:58:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://donklephant.com/?p=15838#comment-523966</guid>
		<description>MR,

I mean, yes and no. I&#039;ve seen it before, but as more and more high profile politicians and members of these groups reveal themselves to be closet racists, it just makes me wonder how much actual real racism out there. Color me naive, but I thought we were getting beyond that. 

But to the broader point, racism sucks, but the whole &quot;socialist/communist&quot; thing is just out to lunch. Do these people not understand how the relationship between government and free enterprise works? Or how the government shouldn&#039;t necessarily be as &quot;efficient&quot; as corporations since they&#039;re building the foundations that businesses operate on? And that&#039;s ignoring the fact that 90% of all businesses fail within their first year, so who knows what &quot;efficiency&quot; really means anyway. Moreover, do they not get the oligarchy that is the modern corporate system and how deregulation has actually led to less competition, not more?

Excuse me, I have to punch a few more holes in my wall.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>MR,</p>
<p>I mean, yes and no. I&#8217;ve seen it before, but as more and more high profile politicians and members of these groups reveal themselves to be closet racists, it just makes me wonder how much actual real racism out there. Color me naive, but I thought we were getting beyond that. </p>
<p>But to the broader point, racism sucks, but the whole &#8220;socialist/communist&#8221; thing is just out to lunch. Do these people not understand how the relationship between government and free enterprise works? Or how the government shouldn&#8217;t necessarily be as &#8220;efficient&#8221; as corporations since they&#8217;re building the foundations that businesses operate on? And that&#8217;s ignoring the fact that 90% of all businesses fail within their first year, so who knows what &#8220;efficiency&#8221; really means anyway. Moreover, do they not get the oligarchy that is the modern corporate system and how deregulation has actually led to less competition, not more?</p>
<p>Excuse me, I have to punch a few more holes in my wall.</p>
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		<title>By: gerryf</title>
		<link>http://donklephant.com/2009/07/24/ama-delegate-in-obama-witch-doctor-flap/comment-page-1/#comment-523246</link>
		<dc:creator>gerryf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Jul 2009 22:04:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://donklephant.com/?p=15838#comment-523246</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m just wondering what the guy thought the recipients and those to whom this would be passed on to would think on seeing it.

It&#039;s not funny. It&#039;s not pointed. It doesn&#039;t really convey anything. 

We&#039;ve got a hammer and sickle in the ObamaCare, which I get and if you are trying to say ObamaCare is socialized or communist medicine, that&#039;s ok, I get that, and it&#039;s pretty clever.

But the ceremonial African dress?  I dunno. Maybe a witch doctor if I think about it for a little bit, but gad, you&#039;d have to be a moron to think this is going to convince anyone of anything.

You instantly lose any credibility as a reasonable proponant of an argument with crap like this. 

What a tool.



Even if you are</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m just wondering what the guy thought the recipients and those to whom this would be passed on to would think on seeing it.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s not funny. It&#8217;s not pointed. It doesn&#8217;t really convey anything. </p>
<p>We&#8217;ve got a hammer and sickle in the ObamaCare, which I get and if you are trying to say ObamaCare is socialized or communist medicine, that&#8217;s ok, I get that, and it&#8217;s pretty clever.</p>
<p>But the ceremonial African dress?  I dunno. Maybe a witch doctor if I think about it for a little bit, but gad, you&#8217;d have to be a moron to think this is going to convince anyone of anything.</p>
<p>You instantly lose any credibility as a reasonable proponant of an argument with crap like this. </p>
<p>What a tool.</p>
<p>Even if you are</p>
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		<title>By: michael reynolds</title>
		<link>http://donklephant.com/2009/07/24/ama-delegate-in-obama-witch-doctor-flap/comment-page-1/#comment-523238</link>
		<dc:creator>michael reynolds</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Jul 2009 21:50:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://donklephant.com/?p=15838#comment-523238</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;... Iâ€™m starting to have a hard time believing that a fair amount of these anti-government folks arenâ€™t closet racists.&lt;/i&gt;

You&#039;re not really surprised, are you?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>&#8230; Iâ€™m starting to have a hard time believing that a fair amount of these anti-government folks arenâ€™t closet racists.</i></p>
<p>You&#8217;re not really surprised, are you?</p>
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